What would the army do?

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JMISBEST
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What would the army do?

Postby JMISBEST » Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:17 pm

What would any Traveller World do if their world was at war with another world and Mercenaries that used to be loyal to the other world left the enemy and tried to join their side when they found out that their side was willing to commit crimes against sentient species(Traveller Version of crimes against Humanity) if it meant they would win and that was and still is a line that even a Mercenary Force who willingly uses methods whose legality is as questionable as theirs is refuses to cross
Old School
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Re: What would the army do?

Postby Old School » Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:31 pm

They way you phrase your question it is impossible to tell which side is willing to commit the atrocities. Take the effort to use several sentences to give us a set up, or at least use names to clarify the "they" ,"theirs" and, "their side".
Pyromancer
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Re: What would the army do?

Postby Pyromancer » Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:35 pm

As with most of your questions, the answer is: It depends.
JMISBEST
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Re: What would the army do?

Postby JMISBEST » Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:42 pm

Its the side that the defecting Mercenaries used to be loyal to and fight for, they are the bad guys in the war but not in a way that the good guys or anyone fighting for them or supporting them can prove, and despite being often being very nasty in ways that sometimes border on despicable and some of The Defecting Mercenaries past actions being of very questionable legality their are things even they won't do, especially something like willingly committing crimes against sentient species in order to increase their chances of at least a stalemate/no winner and no loser, where they're better off afterwards is something even they won't do, although if paid enough some of them may overlook their unknowingly their committing crimes against sentient species is
Condottiere
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Re: What would the army do?

Postby Condottiere » Fri Aug 03, 2018 7:43 pm

Read Pournelle's Falkenberg's Legion.

Mercenaries will want to avoid breaking their contracts, and standard ones will have caveats regarding war crimes.
phavoc
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Re: What would the army do?

Postby phavoc » Sat Aug 04, 2018 12:22 am

JMISBEST wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:17 pm
What would any Traveller World do if their world was at war with another world and Mercenaries that used to be loyal to the other world left the enemy and tried to join their side when they found out that their side was willing to commit crimes against sentient species(Traveller Version of crimes against Humanity) if it meant they would win and that was and still is a line that even a Mercenary Force who willingly uses methods whose legality is as questionable as theirs is refuses to cross
Wow. That's a run-on sentence / word atrocity waiting to happen. But let's try to parse this out:

What would any Traveller World do if their world was at war with another world and Mercenaries that used to be loyal to the other world left the enemy and tried to join their side Generally speaking, a mercenary unit that would defect from it's employer may find it very hard to get a new contract. Employers who are buying soldiers take a very dim view on turncoats. And there may be severe financial penalties on the unit if they were to do so (depending on what underlying ground rules governed the economics of mercenary hiring).

left the enemy and tried to join their side when they found out that their side was willing to commit crimes against sentient species(Traveller Version of crimes against Humanity) Three will be honorable units that might do so, and units with no honor who would not care one whit. I suspect the bulk would simply opt to not take part in the crimes. These are, after all, professional killers whose job is to fight and kill for money (i.e. they are mercenaries). The level of scruples may not be terribly high. But even if they are, their job is to fight honorably. The fact that their employers are killing babies and eating their entrails may, or may not do anything other than have them keep their distance, or perhaps be on the lookout for a way to legally break their contract.

if it meant they would win and that was and still is a line that even a Mercenary Force who willingly uses methods whose legality is as questionable as theirs is refuses to cross This doesn't make a lot of logical sense as written. You state in a follow-up that the there are "good guys" and "bad guys", but that always depend on the viewer and their beliefs. And when you say "prove" you are getting into the propaganda war portion of warfare. Early on people did not believe what the Germans were doing to Jews until they started liberating the death camps, and even then some refused to believe it. Much like today people refuse to believe the 9/11 attack was terrorists and instead was an inside job by the government. Dealing with stupid conspiracy theory believers is hard at any time.

TL;DR - maybe they would, maybe they wouldn't.
Tom Kalbfus
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Re: What would the army do?

Postby Tom Kalbfus » Sat Aug 04, 2018 5:09 am

the Army would do push-ups!
M J Dougherty
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Re: What would the army do?

Postby M J Dougherty » Sat Aug 04, 2018 11:33 am

That's a good answer. I've pondered its many metaphysical connotations, and I agree. The army would pass the matter up several pay grades and do pushups, in a figurative or perhaps even literal sense.

What would the higher-up do? That depends on so many factors that it's impossible to say.
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Re: What would the army do?

Postby steve98052 » Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:37 pm

Mercenaries would do pretty much exactly what their contract allowed. If the contract included a clause that allowed the unit, or individuals, to withdraw their services if they were asked to participate in atrocities, they might, particularly if the bulk of their contracted payment had cleared, or if the down payment had cleared and the ticket looked like a mess in the works. Their contract might even include a clause allowing withdrawal if the unit were asked to stand by while allied forces committed atrocities.

In some regions, such clauses might even be required for a mercenary unit to be licensed for recognition as a legal mercenary force. In that case, there might still be a few rogue units that tolerate atrocities, and there would always be bloodthirsty individuals who participate in atrocities just because they are horrible people.

But no professional mercenary force would flip sides or even withdraw from a conflict except under the terms of the contract, unless they had solid evidence of an unacceptable situation that had been neglected to be mentioned in the contract. (And that situation, no matter how obscure, would soon turn up in their future mercenary contracts, as well as those of their fellow mercenary companies, making the contracts progressively more bulky and loaded with legalese.) Flipping sides, or withdrawing without good reason, will ruin a reputation, and is likely to lead to captured mercenaries being killed rather than released on repatriation bond.
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Re: What would the army do?

Postby Rikki Tikki Traveller » Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:13 pm

They would always welcome them with open arms and throw a big party - charged to the General of the Army.
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Condottiere
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Re: What would the army do?

Postby Condottiere » Sat Aug 11, 2018 5:24 pm

There's the Wright Way.

Image

And there's the wrong weigh.

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And then there's the Army way.

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