High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

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kevinknight
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High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby kevinknight » Wed Aug 30, 2017 10:19 pm

I was surprised to hear from a reliable source that the cap on MD ratings in the OTU was 6 for ships larger than 100 tons. I was unable to find any sort of rules reference to this, though. Could someone please point me to where this is stated? Thanks!
BTW, this was brought up when I pointed out that the ships in Drinax all had 6 or less...
Jeraa
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby Jeraa » Wed Aug 30, 2017 10:30 pm

kevinknight wrote:
Wed Aug 30, 2017 10:19 pm
I was surprised to hear from a reliable source that the cap on MD ratings in the OTU was 6 for ships larger than 100 tons. I was unable to find any sort of rules reference to this, though. Could someone please point me to where this is stated? Thanks!
BTW, this was brought up when I pointed out that the ships in Drinax all had 6 or less...
Previous editions (pre-Mongoose) sometimes had a cap at 6-g (and jump-6) for everything.

Mongoose 1e has the same cap of 6, except for small craft which could go up to 16g. This was never actually stated in text, but it is what appears on the drive performance tables.

Mongoose 2e doesn't have any of that, so any ship could potentially use any size maneuver drive.
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby AndrewW » Wed Aug 30, 2017 10:34 pm

kevinknight wrote:
Wed Aug 30, 2017 10:19 pm
I was surprised to hear from a reliable source that the cap on MD ratings in the OTU was 6 for ships larger than 100 tons. I was unable to find any sort of rules reference to this, though. Could someone please point me to where this is stated? Thanks!
BTW, this was brought up when I pointed out that the ships in Drinax all had 6 or less...
High Guard isn't specific to the OTU, so it allows for some ships that wouldn't 'fit' the OTU. Yes, the cap is still there but isn't specifically mention in High Guard, for your own purposes use it or not as you see fit.
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:25 am

Does High Guard for 2nd Edition Mongoose Traveller mention other drive types? In the playtest there were other starship drive types.
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby AndrewW » Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:33 am

ShawnDriscoll wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:25 am
Does High Guard for 2nd Edition Mongoose Traveller mention other drive types? In the playtest there were other starship drive types.
Yes.

Hyperdrive, Jump Drives, Reaction Drives, Space Folding Drive, Time Drive and Warp Drive are covered.
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby Reynard » Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:37 am

I assume you mean non-jump drive. There is also the reaction drives for Mongoose. T5 rounds up several non-jump drives used over the editions, gravitic, rocket, HEPlaR, and Not As Fast As Light drives.
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:47 am

AndrewW wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:33 am
ShawnDriscoll wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:25 am
Does High Guard for 2nd Edition Mongoose Traveller mention other drive types? In the playtest there were other starship drive types.
Yes.

Hyperdrive, Jump Drives, Reaction Drives, Space Folding Drive, Time Drive and Warp Drive are covered.
That's pretty cool. Would you say that the current edition of High Guard is more of a generic book, than a Traveller setting book?
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby AndrewW » Thu Aug 31, 2017 2:01 am

ShawnDriscoll wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:47 am
That's pretty cool. Would you say that the current edition of High Guard is more of a generic book, than a Traveller setting book?
Yup. Of course a lot applies to the Third Imperium setting as well. Could think of it as a toolkit to build your own setting. The parts are there, how you assemble them is up to you.
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Thu Aug 31, 2017 3:00 am

AndrewW wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 2:01 am
ShawnDriscoll wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:47 am
That's pretty cool. Would you say that the current edition of High Guard is more of a generic book, than a Traveller setting book?
Yup. Of course a lot applies to the Third Imperium setting as well. Could think of it as a toolkit to build your own setting. The parts are there, how you assemble them is up to you.
Ok. The reason I ask is because I get asked about the new High Guard every week by players who don't have the book. So I'll tell them what you said. Build your own setting.
kevinknight
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby kevinknight » Thu Aug 31, 2017 2:09 pm

Sure, yeah, I could use that book to build my own setting... maybe one where ships don't need drives and giant space monkeys fling starships like poo between the stars... then not buy any of the Mongoose 3rd Imperium books. But let's say, hypothetically, that I WANT to use the 3rd Imperium setting... like I have the the last 35 years... it would be nice to have clearly delineated setting rules for the 3rd Imperium. The High Technology chapter, while still a bit vague, was at least a good spot for stuff not intended for the 3rd Imperium setting.
When I saw the faster maneuver drives, I simply thought 'Finally! Someone got off their duff and expanded the STL drives past TL11/12 (where apparently all research on them stopped).'
You use the argument that you based this cap off of the previous editions. However, there are lots of things in this book that didn't exist in the previous editions and that aren't in the High Tech chapter... and I'm not just talking about TL16+ stuff.
Computer Cores didn't exist in the previous editions. Does that mean they are not official in the 3rd Imp?
Tachyon Cannons didn't exist in the previous editions. Does that mean they are not official in the 3rd Imp?
Ion Cannons didn't exist in the previous editions. Does that mean they are not official in the 3rd Imp?
Gravimetric Distorters didn't exist in the previous editions. Does that mean they are not official in the 3rd Imp?
Some of the missiles/torpedoes didn't exist in the previous editions. Does that mean they are not official in the 3rd Imp?
Then you have the opposite side... Meson Bays existed in previous editions, but now they're in the High Tech chapter.
I could go on, but I'll stop here. For most of us, Traveller IS the 3rd Imperium. I'm fine with you putting rules in that aren't intended for use in the 3rd Imperium to broaden your appeal to those who don't like the 3rd Imperium, but PLEASE clearly define what is and isn't allowed in the books, without having to come to the forums to find out. I mean, all it would have taken was a sidebar like the one you put in about spinal mounts
This irritates me personally because I've been working on a novel for the last two years set in the 3rd Imperium and based off our campaign. Now I'm beginning to wonder how much of it is unofficial because the new rules didn't specify clearly what was and wasn't acceptable. Guess I should have just stuck with 1st edition and ignored everything from 2nd...
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby AndrewW » Thu Aug 31, 2017 4:30 pm

These items are usually not found within the Third Imperium setting:

Gravimetic Distorter, Gravity Well Generator, Ion Cannon, Neutron Laser, Plasma Pulse Cannon, Solar Pulse Generator, Super Laser, Tachyon Cannon.

The following items are uncommon but may occasionally be seen:

Antimatter Spinal Mount, Collectors, Meson Bay (possibly for larger ships, but I never got a definitive answer on that one).

A ship can only form a jump bubble if it has a hull of 100 or more tons.

Manoeuvre drives are limited to thrust 6 for ships of 100 or more tons.

Note some is from canon changes handed down from above (ie: meson bays)
ShawnDriscoll
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Thu Aug 31, 2017 4:49 pm

kevinknight wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 2:09 pm
This irritates me personally because I've been working on a novel for the last two years set in the 3rd Imperium and based off our campaign. Now I'm beginning to wonder how much of it is unofficial because the new rules didn't specify clearly what was and wasn't acceptable.
Talk to Marc Miller about your book you're writing. He lets me know what is and isn't in the 3rd Imperium.
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby Sigtrygg » Thu Aug 31, 2017 5:17 pm

T5 allows ships to have maneuver drives of up to 9g at TL15...

has MWM retconned his own retcon?
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby Reynard » Thu Aug 31, 2017 6:47 pm

More compatibility between MgT and T5 without them becoming the same product?
kevinknight
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby kevinknight » Thu Aug 31, 2017 7:10 pm

AndrewW wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 4:30 pm
These items are usually not found within the Third Imperium setting:

Gravimetic Distorter, Gravity Well Generator, Ion Cannon, Neutron Laser, Plasma Pulse Cannon, Solar Pulse Generator, Super Laser, Tachyon Cannon.

The following items are uncommon but may occasionally be seen:

Antimatter Spinal Mount, Collectors, Meson Bay (possibly for larger ships, but I never got a definitive answer on that one).

A ship can only form a jump bubble if it has a hull of 100 or more tons.

Manoeuvre drives are limited to thrust 6 for ships of 100 or more tons.

Note some is from canon changes handed down from above (ie: meson bays)
Thanks, Andrew. But where does it state this in the rule book? Most of the weapons you listed are in High Tech, but others are just in the regular rules. Without prior knowledge how would one know they were not found in the 3I? I'm aware, as a long time player, that some of those are new, but I just thought they were additional options added with this edition. A new player would have not the least clue that they actually were not allowed.

Shawn,
I submitted my book to Marc last week, but I now foresee it being returned with REJECTED stamped on it. You see, the whole premise behind it was an experimental TL16 ship with MD10, Tachyon Bay, and other things NOT in the High Tech chapter, but new stuff in the regular rules...
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Thu Aug 31, 2017 8:09 pm

kevinknight wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 7:10 pm
Shawn,
I submitted my book to Marc last week, but I now foresee it being returned with REJECTED stamped on it. You see, the whole premise behind it was an experimental TL16 ship with MD10, Tachyon Bay, and other things NOT in the High Tech chapter, but new stuff in the regular rules...
I guess when a new 3rd Imperium book gets released, we'll then know what stuff from these 2nd edition Mongoose books are used by that setting or not.

If Marc likes your stuff, guess what! It gets included in the canon.
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby Nathan Brazil » Fri Sep 01, 2017 5:39 am

kevinknight wrote:
Thu Aug 31, 2017 2:09 pm
But let's say, hypothetically, that I WANT to use the 3rd Imperium setting... like I have the the last 35 years... it would be nice to have clearly delineated setting rules for the 3rd Imperium. The High Technology chapter, while still a bit vague, was at least a good spot for stuff not intended for the 3rd Imperium setting.
Are you the same Kevin Knight who did The Traveller Chronicle? That magazine was awessome sauce!

Within the context of the 3rd Imperium setting, the Traveller 5 Rulebook published by Far Future Enterprises posts ratings of Power 8, Maneuver 9, and Jump 6 at TL 15. In addition, other drives are given, many of which get rated up to 9 as well. So your manuscript may be salvageable. Sorry to muddy the waters I try to be complete. But yes, Mr. Miller is the final authority of course.
0401 X55A670-A S he+ hi++ as va ith-- vr+ ne- so+ 733
IMTU tc+ tm tn++ t4+ tg t20++ ru ge++ 3i+ c+ jt-- au- ls pi+ ta he+ hi++ as va ith-- vr+ ne- so+
kevinknight
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby kevinknight » Fri Sep 01, 2017 1:12 pm

Thank you, and yes, that was me :). It was a lot of fun to do and I was sad when the industry took a nose dive and we had to close up shop.
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby Sigtrygg » Fri Sep 01, 2017 1:21 pm

If you want to understand the current state of play of the OTU 3I setting and the technology contained with I would recommend T5 and MWM's novel Agent of the Imperium.
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Re: High Guard, Maneuver Drives, and the OTU

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Fri Sep 01, 2017 3:27 pm

T5 seems to be set up for settings beyond the 3I's 1105.

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