Does the Imperial Nobility extend to client states?

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paltrysum
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Does the Imperial Nobility extend to client states?

Postby paltrysum » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:03 pm

One of my players has a social standing of 12 and claimed his homeworld to be Regina. The campaign we're running is a long way from home, in the Trojan Reach. I came up with the idea that his family is disappointed in his departure from their ancestral home, but that perhaps he could claim his fief somewhere else. If he intends to settle long-term in Trojan Reach, perhaps he could get his baronial two planetary hexes there.

If such a thing were to be allowed, how do you see that playing out with client states? Do you see the Imperium granting a fief on a world like Dostoevsky, Kydde, Bantral, or Vorito?
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Jame Rowe
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Re: Does the Imperial Nobility extend to client states?

Postby Jame Rowe » Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:37 pm

Three subsectors in Trojan Reach are Imperial territory: Pax Rulin, Gazulin and Tobia.
There is nothing to stop your player from being from there.
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Epicenter
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Re: Does the Imperial Nobility extend to client states?

Postby Epicenter » Sat Apr 22, 2017 1:47 am

Historically, a client state is basically a state ranging anywhere from being a reluctant allies to being a puppet state. The idea comes from the Roman Empire.

The idea is that your kids are taken to be educated / hostages and are educated in the Imperium, they come back and eventually come to rule their nation as good allies who have adopted the Roman mindset. In return for all of this, the Romans will trade with you and will likely protect you from foreign aggressors. How they actually felt about being Clients varied from nation to nation, but most were walking a tightrope - they were basically not conquered by Rome because Rome didn't want to put in the effort. Most client states ended up being annexed by Rome at some point, often within a generation or two of becoming clients.

The Imperium's Clients seem a bit different. There are some large scale maps of Charted Space where you see "Imperial Client States" who are on the other side of the Zhodani Consulate (and lots of them). I have no idea how that Imperium can really offer much of anything to Clients way out there - the Imperium certainly isn't going to go to war with the Zhodani over them. I suspect they're out there because someone decided to interpret "Client State" as "allied nations" or "bloc nations" from the 21st century.

Given their situation, it's very likely an Imperial noble would be given courtesy while in a client state - insults or outrages to an Imperial noble by foreigners is one of those things the Imperium isn't going to look too kindly on.

Similarly, an Imperial-educated ruler of a planet might miss how things were during his or her school days in Capital and might want to surround him/herself with Imperials to sort of relive the old days so might grant an Imperial noble a fief on a world. Of course, there's always the concern that such a foreign educated ruler is out of step with the actual natives of the world, who might feel like their king/queen is outsiders come and govern them. This could cause considerable resentment. On the other hand, the fief might be granted in a place where few if any people live. The ruler might also harbor some desire for independence from the Imperium so might grant a fief as a kind of poisoned chalice - assigning the player a fief that is deliberately difficult to tame or ungovernable in some way in the hopes of showing the Imperium in a bad light to the locals. Or the local people might be enthusiastic about an Imperial noble.
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Re: Does the Imperial Nobility extend to client states?

Postby Condottiere » Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:52 am

You can, but it's a conflict of interest.

Even as a client kingdom, in theory, the elite's primary loyalty is to their state.

If they hold Imperium fiefs, they've also directly sworn loyalty and fealty to the Emperor.
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Re: Does the Imperial Nobility extend to client states?

Postby Tom Kalbfus » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:12 pm

What if the client state is a republic that does not recognize noble titles, it could still be an Imperial Client state despite that, if there is some benefit to the Imperium for having this relationship, they aren't going to insist that they recognize imperial titles.
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Re: Does the Imperial Nobility extend to client states?

Postby Condottiere » Sat Apr 22, 2017 11:41 pm

Depends on their laws regarding foreign awards.

I think it would be mentioned under an emoluments clause.

The Title of Nobility Clause is a provision in Article I, Section 9, Clause 8 of the United States Constitution,[1] that prohibits the federal government from granting titles of nobility, and restricts members of the government from receiving gifts, emoluments, offices or titles from foreign states without the consent of the United States Congress. Also known as the Emoluments Clause, it was designed to shield the republican character of the United States against so-called "corrupting foreign influences". This shield is reinforced by the corresponding prohibition on state titles of nobility in Article I, Section 10, and more generally by the Republican Guarantee Clause in Article IV, Section 4.[2]
paltrysum
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Re: Does the Imperial Nobility extend to client states?

Postby paltrysum » Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:19 pm

Great suggestions, guys. Thanks!
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Re: Does the Imperial Nobility extend to client states?

Postby steve98052 » Sat May 20, 2017 8:41 pm

I generated a bunch of characters for players in a quick start game, and I wanted to invent a little background for each. One was a noble elevated from a middle class background. I decided that in that case the Imperial nobility decided that his or her (I think I left gender unspecified) accomplishments earned a noble title, but there wasn't really a suitable fief for the title -- much like modern UK titles. His or her background skills were ground vehicle maintenance, so I decided that the character came from a family that owned a ground vehicle repair business. So when the character was ennobled, the family home and the land where the family business had shops was the character's fief.

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