The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Discuss the Traveller RPG and its many settings
Jak Nazryth
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby Jak Nazryth » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:12 pm

I just downloaded mine late last night but didn't have time to go through it. I can't wait to crack it open!

But here is what I want to do.

I want to create a grav sled, a futuristic version of a "trailer".
The biggest problem with an air/raft is that there is no freaking room for cargo. Kind of like a jeep. What do you do when you need to move across town or to another state, or help your buddy move out of his girlfriends apartment?
Rent a trailer, hitch it to the back of you jeep.

That is my intent. Make a floating platform that can get it's power from the vehicle its attached to, or have a variant with it's own power source. It wont be enough to make it move, just enough to overcome gravity. The control cables attached to what ever is pulling it will send signals to adjust height, stabilize, help with "breaking" by shifting some of the contra-grav energy in a way to help slow down, etc... But basically yeah.. it's for the team of explorers who only have an air/raft but want to haul 2 tons of equipment behind them. (basically 4 squares). It will be attached with a "neck" so that it can rotate/pivot interdependently when required (but that motion can be controlled by the driver of what ever is pulling it)
You can even have a 1 ton version that is attached directly the the back of an air/raft and can fold up when not in use (like a big bike rack or a platform people use today to carry their motorized wheel chairs around on). This might be the most popular option since a folded up platform wouldn't take any more shipping space (like in an air/raft bay)
They can be complete flat and open (with places to tie down straps of course), have side walls, cattle car style, or even fully enclosed.
Grav Sleds can also come in the 3 ton, 4 ton, and up to 8 ton range... your basic "18 wheeler" of the future.
This will of course reduce the top speed of what ever is pulling it. I'll just have to dig into the rules the next few days to find out how it will work.

I want to get started by the end of the week.

Has anyone every designed something like this?
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby G. K. Zhukov » Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:51 am

I also preordered the VHB and sent an eMail to Matt for the pdf, but the file has not arrived so far...

Looking forward to check it.
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby Jak Nazryth » Sat Feb 18, 2017 6:18 pm

Ok, Finally opening up the book (pdf) and trying to create my first vehicle today.
This is my very first attempt to create a vehicle. I'm a vehicle building noob.
Sorry if this is a dumb question, but how big is a "space"?
I can't find the definition anywhere.
I'm using the air/raft as a go-by. Everybody knows the area an air/raft occupies and a ship is 4 tons.
But how many "spaces" does an air/raft have?
On page 96, the number of "spaces" is not listed, only the shipping volume of 4 tons and .25 tons of cargo.
The cargo version of the air/raft is 1.5 tons.
So how does "spaces" convert to "tons"?

My goal is to create a flat-bed grav sled that an air/raft can pull behind it, like a trailer.
I want it to carry 2 tons of cargo (4 squares) based on star ship freight volume. 3x3 meters.
I know on page 6, the rules say a vehicle can carry 250 kg for each space dedicated to cargo.
Is "one space" a 1.5 x 1.5 square?
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby EldritchFire » Sat Feb 18, 2017 7:40 pm

A space is defined on page 6, Step 5: Crew and Passengers.

"Each crew member and passenger will require 1 Space for basic seating. This kind of seating allows for little or no movement within the vehicle, effectively keeping each passenger and crew member in place (such as with a car, fighter jet or tank)."

As for how much a space is worth, you need to look at each chassis' writeup. An air/raft is a light grav vehicle, and per page 16 that means each space is 0.5 shipping tons. Of course, that doesn't mean that a space can be converted to a half-ton of cargo. Again, page 6 (Atep 6) says that "A vehicle can carry 250 kg for every Space that is dedicated to cargo."

The best way to find out how many spaces a vehicle has is to take the shipping tons and multiply that by the shipping line of the chassis. You could also take the hull points and divide by the hull line, but that's not as accurate since there are options that change the hull points.
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby AnotherDilbert » Sun Feb 19, 2017 4:33 am

A space is 250 kg.
Shipping size is in dT.
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby Jak Nazryth » Mon Feb 20, 2017 4:52 am

I'm disappointed in some aspects of the new rules. There seems to be a lot more options in the original that was left out of the new. There is so much that has been removed from the MgT1 rules... I just don't get it. Where is the Plasma Cannon? What's a Traveller game without a Plasma Tank?
Based on what I've seen so far though, it looks as if you can plug anything in from MgT1 vehicle options (including weapons) into the new rules.

I have a grav cargo sled design under it's own subject line.
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby snrdg121408 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 4:07 pm

Hello AnotherDilbert and EldritchFire,
AnotherDilbert wrote:
Sun Feb 19, 2017 4:33 am
A space is 250 kg.
Shipping size is in dT.
MgT Vehicle Handbook Weapons Section 4 Central Supply Catalog p. 44

"The only conversion that will be necessary is to turn the Mass of each weapon (usually listed in Kg or tons) into Spaces. This is done at a rate of 1 Space for every 250 Kg or 0.25 tons of Mass or part of.

So, for example, a light autocannon has a Mass of 0.25 tons, which is equal to 1 Space. An orbital defence cannon has a Mass of 35 tons, which is equal to a whopping 140 Spaces!"

MgT Vehicle Handbook Weapons Section 5 Spacecraft Weapons p. 44

"To place a spacecraft weapon into a vehicle, simply multiply the tonnage of the weapon by four. This is how many Spaces it will consume, to a minimum of 1 Space. Unless it is to be placed in a fixed mount, it will also need a spacecraft style turret which, at one ton on a spacecraft, will mean another 4 Spaces is required."

If a starship 1 d-ton turret requires 4 spaces the weight is 250 kg x 4 = 1,000 kg = 1 metric ton or IIRC the non-US spelling is tonne on a Vehicle Handbook design.

If HG 2e weapons require 4 spaces per displacement ton wouldn't the same rule apply to the rest of the HG 2e components?
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby snrdg121408 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 5:36 pm

Morning PST,

MgT VHB Chassis Types Unpowered Boat p. 19

Below the left column text the Unpowered Boat TL is 1 the Tech Table at the top of the right column has the TL as 4.

Looking at the other chassis types I believe that the Tech Table entry should be 1 versus 4.

At TL 1 Speed would be Idle and Range would I believe should be lower than the TL 3 Outboard Motor of 100.
Last edited by snrdg121408 on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby AnotherDilbert » Fri Feb 24, 2017 6:50 pm

snrdg121408 wrote: If HG 2e weapons require 4 spaces per displacement ton wouldn't the same rule apply to the rest of the HG 2e components?
It's not even remotely that simple.

Spacecraft: 1 dT ≈ 14 m³ [Volume].
Vehicles: 1 Space ≈ 250 kg [Mass].

Apples and oranges.

There is no direct translation between Spaces and dT.


Weapons from CSC has a mass in tonnes. 1 tonne = 1000 kg, so 1 tonne is 4 Spaces.
In the Vehicle Handbook weapons from HG use 10 Spaces per dT, so 1 dT ≈ 10 Spaces. (Weapon Chapter, Spacecraft Weapons)
In HG vehicle weapons use 1 dT per tonne = 4 Spaces, so 1 dT ≈ 4 Spaces. (HG, Smaller Weapons, p32)
So, 1 dT can be 4 Spaces or 10 Spaces, or something similar, depending on the density of the component.
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby snrdg121408 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 10:30 pm

AnotherDilbert wrote:
Fri Feb 24, 2017 6:50 pm

Weapons from CSC has a mass in tonnes. 1 tonne = 1000 kg, so 1 tonne is 4 Spaces.
The information below is a copy and paste from MgT Vehicle Handbook PDF downloaded 2/21/2017: Chapter 5 Weapons Weapons Section 3, I incorrectly stated the section was 4 earlier, Central Supply Catalog p. 44

"The only conversion that will be necessary is to turn the Mass of each weapon (usually listed in Kg or tons) into Spaces. This is done at a rate of 1 Space for every 250 Kg or 0.25 tons of Mass or part of."

Thank you for confirming that I correctly understood how to convert Central Supply Catalog weight/mass to Vehicle Handbook spaces.
In the Vehicle Handbook weapons from HG use 10 Spaces per dT, so 1 dT ≈ 10 Spaces. (Weapon Chapter, Spacecraft Weapons)
The information below is a copy and paste from MgT Vehicle Handbook PDF downloaded 2/21/2017: Chapter 5 Weapons Section 4, I incorrectly stated the section was 5 earlier, Spacecraft Weapons p. 44

"To place a spacecraft weapon into a vehicle, simply multiply the tonnage of the weapon by four. This is how many Spaces it will consume, to a minimum of 1 Space. Unless it is to be placed in a fixed mount, it will also need a spacecraft style turret which, at one ton on a spacecraft, will mean another 4 Spaces is required."

Please provide the page number that "In the Vehicle Handbook weapons from HG use 10 Spaces per dT, so 1 dT ≈ 10 Spaces" since I can not find the information in my PDF copy.
In HG vehicle weapons use 1 dT per tonne = 4 Spaces, so 1 dT ≈ 4 Spaces. (HG, Smaller Weapons, p32)
So, 1 dT can be 4 Spaces or 10 Spaces, or something similar, depending on the density of the component.
The information below is a copy and paste from MgT HG 2e PDF downloaded 09/11/2016: Chapter 2 Weapons & Screens p. 32

"Smaller Weapons
It is possible to equip a spacecraft with Ground scale weaponry. This is usually done on small craft designed to operate regularly within an atmosphere while engaging ground targets but any spacecraft can use them.

Any weapon with a mass less than 250 kg can be mounted on a spacecraft at a cost of Cr1000 (the cost of the actual weapon is in addition to this). They will draw no Power from the spacecraft, as it is assumed their energy requirements are tiny in comparison to other systems, and nor do they require a hardpoint, but will consume 1 ton. However, up to four such weapons
may be mounted for each ton dedicated to them. They will be attached to fixed mounts on any spacecraft of less than 50 tons, and small pop-up turrets operated from a remote station on larger ships.

Weapons of a mass of 250 kg or more will consume an amount of space equal to their mass, to a minimum of 1 ton. They are required to be mounted in turrets (if they mass one ton or less) or fixed mounts and again, will consume no power."

Ground Scale Weaponry that is less than 0.25 metric tons/250 kg require 1 HG 2e displacement ton and can fit up to four weapons in the space. Per the Vehicle Handbook material from the PDF above 1 HG 2e displacement ton is simply multiplied by 4 which equals 4 Vehicle Handbook spaces.

A 250 kg Ground Scale weapon takes up 1 displacement ton of Spacecraft hull space or 4 Vehicle Handbook spaces.

At least that is what the directions appear to mean to me.
Last edited by snrdg121408 on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby snrdg121408 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 10:34 pm

Afternoon PST,

MgT Vehicle Handbook PDF downloaded 2/21/2017 Ship Chassis Tech Level Table TL 12 Range is 1,200 I believe that the Range should be 12,000.

Is 12,000 correct?
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby AnotherDilbert » Sat Feb 25, 2017 12:11 am

snrdg121408 wrote:
AnotherDilbert wrote: In the Vehicle Handbook weapons from HG use 10 Spaces per dT, so 1 dT ≈ 10 Spaces. (Weapon Chapter, Spacecraft Weapons)
The information below is a copy and paste from MgT Vehicle Handbook PDF downloaded 2/21/2017: Chapter 5 Weapons Section 4, I incorrectly stated the section was 5 earlier, Spacecraft Weapons p. 44

"To place a spacecraft weapon into a vehicle, simply multiply the tonnage of the weapon by four. This is how many Spaces it will consume, to a minimum of 1 Space. Unless it is to be placed in a fixed mount, it will also need a spacecraft style turret which, at one ton on a spacecraft, will mean another 4 Spaces is required."

Please provide the page number that "In the Vehicle Handbook weapons from HG use 10 Spaces per dT, so 1 dT ≈ 10 Spaces" since I can not find the information in my PDF copy.
I have to confess that I looked in the beta version, not the release version. Apparently that is changed, so I was wrong. Ignore what I said.
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby phavoc » Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:00 am

"To place a spacecraft weapon into a vehicle, simply multiply the tonnage of the weapon by four. This is how many Spaces it will consume, to a minimum of 1 Space. Unless it is to be placed in a fixed mount, it will also need a spacecraft style turret which, at one ton on a spacecraft, will mean another 4 Spaces is required."

So if you wanted to mount say a dual turret with a pair of pulse lasers, would that require 12 spaces (or 3 Dtons), or would it require just 4 spaces (1 Dton)? I'm asking because on spacecraft you don't pay extra space penalties like this. You set aside 1Dton for the hardpoint, and you can mount a single/dual/triple turret, and then add weapons and you don't pay for any more space aside from the 1 Dton.
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby snrdg121408 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 3:57 am

Hello AnotherDilbert,
AnotherDilbert wrote:
Sat Feb 25, 2017 12:11 am
snrdg121408 wrote:
AnotherDilbert wrote: In the Vehicle Handbook weapons from HG use 10 Spaces per dT, so 1 dT ≈ 10 Spaces. (Weapon Chapter, Spacecraft Weapons)
The information below is a copy and paste from MgT Vehicle Handbook PDF downloaded 2/21/2017: Chapter 5 Weapons Section 4, I incorrectly stated the section was 5 earlier, Spacecraft Weapons p. 44

"To place a spacecraft weapon into a vehicle, simply multiply the tonnage of the weapon by four. This is how many Spaces it will consume, to a minimum of 1 Space. Unless it is to be placed in a fixed mount, it will also need a spacecraft style turret which, at one ton on a spacecraft, will mean another 4 Spaces is required."

Please provide the page number that "In the Vehicle Handbook weapons from HG use 10 Spaces per dT, so 1 dT ≈ 10 Spaces" since I can not find the information in my PDF copy.
I have to confess that I looked in the beta version, not the release version. Apparently that is changed, so I was wrong. Ignore what I said.
Thank you for confirming that I seem to be correctly reading and understanding the rules regardless of the numbers used in the example.
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby snrdg121408 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 4:30 am

Hello phavoc,
phavoc wrote:
Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:00 am
"To place a spacecraft weapon into a vehicle, simply multiply the tonnage of the weapon by four. This is how many Spaces it will consume, to a minimum of 1 Space. Unless it is to be placed in a fixed mount, it will also need a spacecraft style turret which, at one ton on a spacecraft, will mean another 4 Spaces is required."

So if you wanted to mount say a dual turret with a pair of pulse lasers, would that require 12 spaces (or 3 Dtons), or would it require just 4 spaces (1 Dton)? I'm asking because on spacecraft you don't pay extra space penalties like this. You set aside 1Dton for the hardpoint, and you can mount a single/dual/triple turret, and then add weapons and you don't pay for any more space aside from the 1 Dton.
All spacecraft turrets require 1 displacement ton of space in HG 2e, my understanding is that the dual spacecraft turret would take up four Vehicle Handbook spaces since the turret weapons do not list a displacement tonnage.

The only HG 2e weapon that has a listed displacement tonnage are the spinal mounts and there are a couple of questions I still have in HG 2e about the reloads for missile racks and sandcasters that fit into turrets which are:

1. How can a 1 displacement ton turret hold 12 missiles when the 12 missiles require 1 displacement ton of Space?
2. How can a 1 displacement ton turret hold two, three, or four missile racks or sandcasters fit 24, 36, or 48 reloads that for missiles would be 2, 3, or 4 displacement tons and sandcasters require 1.2, 1.8, or 2.4 displacement tons?
3. Where are the reloads for missile racks and sandcasters stored when they are installed on a fixed mount?
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby Annatar Giftbringer » Sat Feb 25, 2017 4:44 pm

Jak Nazryth wrote:
Mon Feb 20, 2017 4:52 am
Where is the Plasma Cannon? What's a Traveller game without a Plasma Tank?
Relax, the Plasma cannon is still there. Open the Vehicle Weapons chapter of Central Supply Catalogue, turn to p. 132 :)
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby snrdg121408 » Sun Feb 26, 2017 8:19 pm

Afternoon PST,

MgT Vehicle Handbook PDF downloaded 2/21/2017 Chapter 5 Weapons Section 2 p. 40 Early Machine Gun Tons: 14; Spaces: 1

1 Space = 250 kg so the Early Machine Gun's Tons should equal 0.25 tons
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby snrdg121408 » Mon Feb 27, 2017 4:42 pm

Morning PST

MgT Vehicle Handbook PDF downloaded 2/21/17 p. 14 Light Ground Vehicle Rail Rider.

Shouldn't the Rail Rider have the Trait of Drive (Rail) or Drive (Wheel)?

Would a Light Ground Vehicle with an Aquatic Drive require the Trait of Drive (Seafarer)?
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby snrdg121408 » Mon Feb 27, 2017 8:34 pm

Afternoon PST,

MgT Vehicle Handbook PDF p. 36

Light autocannon - Find the perfect flexibility for light vehicles on page XX. page XX should be page. 42
Weapons mounts - Use the latest technology to enhance your vehicle. Page xx should be Pages 37-38
Plasma Missile Rack - For the Traveller with deep pockets, the ultimate in weaponry. Page XX should be Page 43
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Re: The Vehicle Handbook is Here!

Postby snrdg121408 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 7:22 am

Late evening PST,

In the General Forum I have asked for clarification on two items without a response in MgT Vehicle Handbook PDF 2/21/17

1. Light/Heavy Submersible modification Increased Dive p. 22

Increased Dive
By increasing the submersible’s structural strength, it can be made to dive deeper without fear of being crushed by the surrounding water.

For every 100% increase in the submersible’s Cost per Space, its Armour, Safe and Crush Depths are increased by 100%.

A submarine's pressure hull is designed to withstand the extreme pressure generated with depth and does not make good armor which was learned as part of my qualifications earning my Submarine Service Insignia a.k.a Dolphins.

From the details the Hull is the framework which everything is attached to including armor that is designed to add protection to the basic hull.

If Increased Dive really increases Protection does the modification increase both the starting and maximum protection levels?

My recommendation is to increase Hull points rather than Armor Protection.

2. Customization Power Systems External Power Table p. 48 in the Vehicle Type column has the following entries: "Train, Ground Vehicle, Aircraft, and Grave Vehicle."

Is the Train entry a Ground Vehicle with the Rail Rider modification or was the Train entry omitted from the Vehicle Chassis Tables?
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