Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Discuss the Traveller RPG and its many settings
Reynard
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby Reynard » Tue Jan 24, 2017 5:50 pm

I'm also thinking classic Old eccentric scientist who invented the jump drive and has a daughter. Yes, crazy scientist.
Reynard
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby Reynard » Tue Jan 24, 2017 8:01 pm

Glen, you reminded me of My Traveller Universe based on the team using the first prototype jump ship to go to Alpha Centauri where they find the devastated remains of the Droyne homeworld. The project had to keep the whole work quiet originally because of the fear of certain groups on Earth that didn't take the news of radio and tv signals from Epsilon Eridani where the Vargr live might freak out again and start wars.

I need to find that ship and see how it upgrades to 2e.
Condottiere
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby Condottiere » Wed Jan 25, 2017 1:19 am

Let's see.

Two and a half percent volume per parsec; plus five tonnes.

Hundred tonne starship needs two and half tonnes of jump drive per parsec; plus five tonnes.

Technological level nine only permits monojumping.

Doubling the size of that jump drive gets you either five plus five tonnes, or five plus ten tonnes.
AnotherDilbert
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby AnotherDilbert » Wed Jan 25, 2017 1:58 am

Condottiere wrote:Two and a half percent volume per parsec; plus five tonnes.
Drive size = 100 × 2,5% + 5, minimum 10 = 10 dT.
Double drive size = 2 × 10 = 20 dT.

For a 1000 dT ship:
Drive size = 1000 × 2,5% + 5, minimum 10 = 30 dT.
Double drive size = 2 × 30 = 60 dT.

Why would only certain parts of the drive be doubled?
Condottiere
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby Condottiere » Wed Jan 25, 2017 2:19 am

Ten tonnes is minimum.

The formula is consistent.

A one parsec jump drive for a hundred tonne starship is seven and a half tonnes.

Double that as a requirement for an early prototype, you're within the ten tonne minimum.

The question is, if the overhead is doubled.
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby AnotherDilbert » Wed Jan 25, 2017 2:33 am

Condottiere wrote:The question is, if the overhead is doubled.
Size Reduction: This reduces the tonnage consumed by the jump drive by 10%. This can take the drive below the minimum size of 10 tons.
This makes it clear that the size modification is applied to 10 dT.

If the minimum of 10 dT was applied after the modified size, the calculation could not result in a drive size less than 10 dT?
Condottiere
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby Condottiere » Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:01 am

The default minimum.

Though I don't see the cost benefit of trying to eke out en extra one or two or three tonnes from the jump drives, except if it's a rich kid's roadster.
Reynard
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby Reynard » Sat Jun 09, 2018 12:07 am

Going over HG2e designing. A bit of mental synergy gave me the idea that the dawn of jump starts not a TL 9 but when civilizations make the first connections of theories. The tech level a particular piece of technology comes to fruition represents when all the systems and components reach a stable, viable and optimal form. This is the commercial rather than the experimental. Before that are the bulky, expensive prototypes. The Dawn of Jump would be TL 8.

Prototype Jump 1 ship TL 8 MCr.107.1
Hull: Streamlined, light
Armor: 0
Maneuver: 1g, Prototype (Increased size)
Jump: 1, Prototype (Increased size)
Power: Fusion 40 PPs
Fuel 1 Jump, 12 weeks operation
Bridge: Standard
Computer: 5bis
Software: Maneuver/0, Library, Jump Control/1, Prototype (10 bandwidth)
Sensors: Basic
Weapons: Single turret (Laser drill/-/-)
Staterooms: 6 Crew - Pilot, astrogator, engineer, maintenance, medic
Cargo 4 tons
Options: Aerofins, fuel scoops, fuel processor (20t/day), fuel/cargo container (11.55t), workshop, Docking space for 4 ton TL 8 tracked ATV)

This would be one of any similar designs. It could be of any streamlined shape (Forbidden Planet flying saucer?). Fission, solar sails, batteries and reaction drives could replace or supplement fusion and maneuver. It is a relatively cheap testbed and first attempt for local exploration. The fuel/cargo container gives flexibility to jump a 1 parsec gulf while giving it cargo capacity in cluster regions. The crew are test pilots as well as first observers collecting the most macro information but with some ability to look closer... with caution. They will cross train in a variety of skills. These are your first scout crews.


As you can guess, ships during this time will be the ironclad of starships. They might be the only thing to explore and colonize for decades before TL 9 systems are available. Imagine what ships will look like using the equivalent of vacuum tube technology before slimmed down for an integrated circuit world. Oh, by the way, just like the 1940-1960s scifis, your intrepid explorers are outfitted with their TL 8 Vacc suits, audio/visual hand communicators and all those grenades and sidearms first time explorers mandatorily seem to carry while seeking strange new worlds and contact new life.
Last edited by Reynard on Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
AnotherDilbert
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby AnotherDilbert » Sat Jun 09, 2018 10:45 am

You could save some space and about MCr 25 by using Energy Inefficient drives instead of Increased Size. You wouldn't even have to increase the PP.

You could save slightly by using Collapsible Fuel Tanks in the regular cargo hold in stead of the Fuel/Cargo container.

(You uncovered a bug in my spreadsheet, thank you.)
Reynard
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby Reynard » Sat Jun 09, 2018 11:50 am

I gave it the increased engine size for a retro bulky feel. That's why I mention the vacuum tube reference. When you look back at our own technological history, things compact as tech improves. One civilization might have hit on components that control size but are very inefficient at controlling the energy manipulation.

I still like the versatility of the F/CC as integral to a ship design. This is one of many possible designs for prototypes. One civ uses bladders while another uses F/CC and another tries drop tanks to boost over a one parsec rift. All sorts of variations for motive and power sources depending on the concepts of the engineers and the sciences developed. That's the great thing with Mongoose High Guard giving options.

The prototype stage is a time of experimenting and ingenuity. Look at all the designs tried with aircraft and steamships.
Reynard
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Re: Ships at the Dawn of Jump

Postby Reynard » Sun Jun 10, 2018 2:18 pm

Here's another limiter for space exploration especially in its infancy, supplies. You can have all the fuel you want by sacrificing other tonnage and fly further and further out from a supply point. Problem should be the needs of the crew over the time and distance. Regular Traveller adventure rely on ships normally completing a run in one jump/2 weeks then refueling and resupplying, your monthly Life Support and Supplies. It's assumed supplies are swapped out without having to store them somewhere. We regularly handwave supply considerations for long term trips.


For exploration missions, supply and maintenance should be important and will be a limiting factor. You ship might haul enough fuel for 6 jumps plus fuel to run the power for the jump time and exploration but this can run well above the monthly allotment for integral supplies. I suggest using the Life Support Requirement rules from Adventure 1: Beltstrike. It gives cost and space requirements for carrying extra supplies based on the number of people on a ship. This means some tonnage will be dedicated to extended range supply. I often include this on ship designs that are known to spend more time away from bases. The Prototype Jump 1 ship's 4 ton hold is partially for that reason. \


If nothing else, such limitation encourage the creation of depots along routes showing great promise for further exploration and future colonization. Some may be the only reason there's a port on a dead ball that dies out and is abandoned when better routes and technology arrive while this could be the very beginning for a growing starport over the decades. This could also be links of communications for explorers.

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