Navy Event Roll Question

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CaptainOrs
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Navy Event Roll Question

Postby CaptainOrs » Sun Sep 27, 2015 2:47 am

I need clarification on a Navy career event roll. I rolled a 12 and part of that result was to gain a promotion or commission automatically. I'm assuming that means I should not roll for advancement during the advancement phase as opposed to you get this promotion and potentially another in the advancement phase.
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ShawnDriscoll
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Sun Sep 27, 2015 3:55 am

I treat it as an automatic promotion at the end of the term. No roll required.
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby CaptainOrs » Sun Sep 27, 2015 1:52 pm

That's what made the most sense to me as well.
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Capt.
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby grauenwolf » Mon Sep 28, 2015 5:34 am

CaptainOrs wrote:I need clarification on a Navy career event roll. I rolled a 12 and part of that result was to gain a promotion or commission automatically. I'm assuming that means I should not roll for advancement during the advancement phase as opposed to you get this promotion and potentially another in the advancement phase.
We've been talking about it in another thread as well. Some, myself included, see it as a chance to make two promotions in the same year. A rare achievement, but plausible from a game perspective.

I haven't seen an official ruling on it yet.
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby -Daniel- » Mon Sep 28, 2015 6:28 am

grauenwolf wrote: We've been talking about it in another thread as well. Some, myself included, see it as a chance to make two promotions in the same year. A rare achievement, but plausible from a game perspective.

I haven't seen an official ruling on it yet.
Yes, I believe it was CaptainOrs who raised the question in the other thread as well.

I would love to hear an "official" point of view on this one. It would be nice to know what the designer's intent was.
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby CaptainOrs » Mon Sep 28, 2015 4:43 pm

-Daniel- wrote:
grauenwolf wrote: We've been talking about it in another thread as well. Some, myself included, see it as a chance to make two promotions in the same year. A rare achievement, but plausible from a game perspective.

I haven't seen an official ruling on it yet.
Yes, I believe it was CaptainOrs who raised the question in the other thread as well.

I would love to hear an "official" point of view on this one. It would be nice to know what the designer's intent was.
Technically I started this thread before I saw someone mentioned two promotions in a term on the other thread. It's good that you tied them together here though as promotions was not the original topic of the other thread and I don't want to sidetrack that one too much.

With all of the conflicting viewpoints, this definitely needs more clarification in the rulebook!
Thanks,
Capt.
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby -Daniel- » Mon Sep 28, 2015 4:55 pm

CaptainOrs wrote: With all of the conflicting viewpoints, this definitely needs more clarification in the rulebook!
I think we all try to do what we understand the rules are saying, So I of course agree that we need some input. 8)

I will admit though, that if it does turn out that it is only once and an automatic, I have a few Characters that would need adjustment. :mrgreen:
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby MongooseMatt » Thu Oct 15, 2015 12:12 pm

-Daniel- wrote: I would love to hear an "official" point of view on this one. It would be nice to know what the designer's intent was.
Heh :)

Now, you see, this is one of those things that falls into a grey area - as a designer, I would be happy with it going either way. It won't break the game.

Put another way, however it is interpreted is correct.

Now, in a miniatures game, that would be unacceptable. But I do find in RPGs, this kind of thing comes up with an alarming regularity (the whole assignments thing in 1e is a great example of that).

So, now I have a dilemma. Common sense decrees I pick one and adjust the text. But that is kinda imposing my opinion on how you should be playing in your games - and that just don't seem right :)
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby CosmicGamer » Thu Oct 15, 2015 1:47 pm

"gain a promotion or commission automatically"
I see it as clearly indicating to me the normal promotion or commission roll automatically succeeds

Not sure why the "automatically" would be needed otherwise.
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby -Daniel- » Thu Oct 15, 2015 6:10 pm

msprange wrote: So, now I have a dilemma. Common sense decrees I pick one and adjust the text. But that is kinda imposing my opinion on how you should be playing in your games - and that just don't seem right :)
As someone who is not afraid to houserule or adjust rules as needed I would like to offer a slightly different take on this.

I have never seen a designer's attempt to be clear how they saw a rule being used as imposing their opinion onto me. Rather, I have always seen it as their giving me their intent/thinking so I know when I might desire a change or not.

For me, being clear in the rules help me reduce my need to spell out things for my table down to those I want to be different from the rules. In other rules, your opinion as the designer is both important and valuable to me.

I would request you "pick one and adjust the text" and therefore offer me a clear view into your original intent. 8)
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby -Daniel- » Thu Oct 15, 2015 6:11 pm

CosmicGamer wrote:"gain a promotion or commission automatically"
I see it as clearly indicating to me the normal promotion or commission roll automatically succeeds

Not sure why the "automatically" would be needed otherwise.
But does it replace the normal one or is it an additional promotion? That is the element that is unclear to some of us.
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby ShawnDriscoll » Thu Oct 15, 2015 6:39 pm

msprange wrote:So, now I have a dilemma. Common sense decrees I pick one and adjust the text. But that is kinda imposing my opinion on how you should be playing in your games - and that just don't seem right :)
And besides, I'm left-handed. Rules are hard enough as-is for me. Joking.
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby CosmicGamer » Thu Oct 15, 2015 9:08 pm

-Daniel- wrote:
CosmicGamer wrote:"gain a promotion or commission automatically"
I see it as clearly indicating to me the normal promotion or commission roll automatically succeeds

Not sure why the "automatically" would be needed otherwise.
But does it replace the normal one or is it an additional promotion? That is the element that is unclear to some of us.
Both, or rather either one is fine but,

In the section on page 16 for commissions it states
Some events give a bonus DM to advancement rolls (see below), or grant automatic advancement. You can apply these DMs to commission rolls also. If you gain a commission, you may not roll for advancement in the same term.
Bonus DM and automatic are in the same sentence.

To me, implying that automatic, just like a DM, is applied to the normal advancement (or commission) and not an additional one.

If somehow people still want to interpret things such that two promotions/advancements are possible, the publisher has already chimed in and said do whichever you wish.
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby -Daniel- » Thu Oct 15, 2015 9:19 pm

CosmicGamer wrote: If somehow people still want to interpret things such that two promotions/advancements are possible, the publisher has already chimed in and said do whichever you wish.
I appreciate that, but I will still suggest that in this case, the publisher shouldn't leave it vague and should select one or the other and make the rules as clean and clear as possible.

Part of the value of a playtest is to help clean up and clarify the rules. I think, in my opinion, this is one of those situations where leaving it vague does not serve the game.
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Re: Navy Event Roll Question

Postby CosmicGamer » Thu Oct 15, 2015 9:42 pm

-Daniel- wrote:I appreciate that, but I will still suggest that in this case, the publisher shouldn't leave it vague and should select one or the other and make the rules as clean and clear as possible.

Part of the value of a playtest is to help clean up and clarify the rules. I think, in my opinion, this is one of those situations where leaving it vague does not serve the game.
I generally agree that if you are going to have a rule, clarity is good.

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