[Elric] The Whitelands ?

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rust
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[Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby rust » Sun Jan 06, 2013 10:53 am

After reading Secrets of the Steppes I am now thinking about
moving my Asornok setting, a culture of arctic hunters, to a
modified Elric universe. My Asor would fit well into the White-
lands on the northeast coast of the Pale Sea, but before I mo-
ve them there I would like to find out whether there is already
some more material available from previous editions of Elric or
Stormbringer that describes the lands and societies around the
northern Pale Sea, Tarkesh and Ilmiora and whatever is north
of them.

Thank you very much for any comments and informations. :D
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby DamonJynx » Sun Jan 06, 2013 12:02 pm

The only thing I can think of is Chaosium's Atlas of The Young Kingdoms. That dealt with the northernmost continent but I don't think it went into the steppe lands and beyond. As far as I'm aware (and there are some reasonable sized gaps in my Elric lore), there wasn't much if anything at all in the stories. I've no clue other than the aforementioned Atlas and of course, Secrets of the Steppes, of any RPG products.
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby Olaus Petrus » Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:21 pm

Mongoose's upcoming Talons of Winter adds further details to the northern lands:
Throughout the Young Kingdoms travellers’ tales tell of the fabulous valley of Xanardwys. Here a legendary city is reputed to be sited in an enchanted land whose waters possess blessed warmth which resist the cruel winters of the surrounding tundra. Reputedly, roses bloom against the surrounding snow and fortunes can be made by trading with its peaceful citizens for precious metals, ivory and health restoring potions. Wisdom too can be sought if the city’s famous seers can be successfully implored.

Talons of Winter adds further locations to the remote northlands of the Young Kingdoms Northern Continent which are described in Secrets of the Steppes. The city of Xanardwys, its customs, key locations and notable citizens are described and several scenario seeds are included. The mysterious and fearsome northern giants of the Fire Mountains are detailed, as is the dreaded Snow Hag, a fearsome troll-like sorcerer of the frozen Whitelands.

The book also presents Vengeance Served Cold, a flexible campaign in which the numerous plot hooks and scenarios provided for the different regions of the Northern Continent’s steppe can be woven together. As a band of intrepid adventurers’ journey through the unmapped realms they encounter an ancient enmity against the city. The ruthless ambitions of Gods and the rivalries of their favoured agents clash and threaten to plunge the whole of the Dakwinsi Steppe into a savage war of annihilation.
It's current status is editing, so it's probably published relatively soon. Aforementioned Atlas of the Young Kingdoms gives description of Ilmiora and Sighing Desert (but it doesn't describe lands north of it), but it's geography differs from that of Elric and you'll have to do some converting if you want to use it. (Moorcock is often vague in his description of Young Kingdoms and that has left plenty of room for different interpretations).
havercake lad
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby havercake lad » Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:34 pm

Talons of Winter should indeed double the Moongoose material covering this part of The Young Kingdoms.

The following Chaosium books included pieces on the northern reaches.

Perils of the Young Kingdoms had a excellet scenario 'The Fang and the Fountain' by Richard watts. It is set along the northern coastline of Tarkesh.

The scenario seed 'The Serpent Hunters' in the Elric Supplement 'Sailing on the Seas of Fate' is easily located in the Pale Sea. The featured ship is largely crewed by Tarkeshites.
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby havercake lad » Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:02 pm

Oh ! Just remembered following pieces that include remote parts of Tarkesh.

Selavial's Curse: RPG adventure from Valkyrie magazine.

A Home by the Sea: Tournament adventure..by Lawrence Whitaker ! Printed in Ye Booke of Tentacles IV.

'The Grey Giant': Scenario seed/NPC in Charles Green's 'Gods of Chaos' (Chaosium's Monograph series #0308)
rust
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby rust » Sun Jan 06, 2013 8:40 pm

Thank you all very much for the helpful informations. :D
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby Big Orc » Mon Jan 07, 2013 8:46 pm

The Moorcock multiverse is so diverse that any society can be found anywhere in the miriad versions of the Young kingdoms. As long as the logic, or illogic, of the GM's world is followed it does not matter where you wish to put anything. The important thing to get right is the amount of enjoyment your group gets from playing the game.
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby rust » Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:22 pm

Big Orc wrote:The Moorcock multiverse is so diverse that any society can be found anywhere in the miriad versions of the Young kingdoms. As long as the logic, or illogic, of the GM's world is followed it does not matter where you wish to put anything. The important thing to get right is the amount of enjoyment your group gets from playing the game.
True, but a culture of arctic hunters obviously does best in an
arctic environment, and to get enjoyment from playing the ga-
me requires that the player characters from this culture have
an interesting choice of options where to go and what to do, so
the neighbouring cultures are quite important. Unless I want to
spend the effort to design them, too, the best way to handle it
is to look for a suitable niche for my culture in the already pub-
lished material - in this case the east coast of the northern Pale
Sea seems best, and the more of the already published material
I can use or modify, the more I can concentrate on my culture
and its relations with its neighbourhood.
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby rust » Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:28 pm

A first draft of a map of Asornok in the north of the Young
Kingdoms could perhaps look like this. It continues where
the map on page 12 of Secrets of the Steppes ends.

The borders of Asornok would be the Blue Ice Glacier (as a
source of meteoritic iron) and Walrus Island (as a source of
ivory) in the north and the Black Glass Mountains (as a sour-
ce of obsidian) in the south.

The two permanent camps of the semi-nomadic Asor would
be An Madol and Nan Asor (the "capital") on the coast, the
holy site of their Anganoka (female shamans) would be on
the island Nuk Hurom.
Attachments
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rust
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby rust » Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:44 pm

Unless Talons of Winter changes the situation completely,
the main outside contacts of the Asor would be the nor-
thernmost tribes of the Bastanissi nomads, the whalers
from Shad in Ilmiora and probably the inhabitants of Xa-
nardwys, perhaps also seafarers from Tarkesh. I think
this should offer sufficient opportunities for trade, and al-
so opportunities to follow the trade routes to explore the
strange southern lands (or opportunities for Southerners
to follow the trade routes to Asornok and take a look at
the strange primitives there ...).
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby Olaus Petrus » Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:53 pm

And even if it changes things and gives detailed description of that region, it's always possible to move it those tribes bit further North or make that region an island (or islands) between the Whitelands and lands north of Tarkesh. And it could be possible (although dangerous) to travel across the ice from mainland to island.
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby havercake lad » Thu Jan 10, 2013 8:30 am

Olaus Petrus wrote:And even if it changes things and gives detailed description of that region, it's always possible to move it those tribes bit further North or make that region an island (or islands) between the Whitelands and lands north of Tarkesh. And it could be possible (although dangerous) to travel across the ice from mainland to island.
Talons of Winter won't extend the existing map in Secrets of Winter. It will add details for the Yyrisshi Marshlands, Fire Mountains and the Xanardwys Valley.

I would imagine that the lands of the Asor are mainly around the coast and that their winters are getting harsher and longer as the climate of the Whitelands expands. I would imagine that the Snow Hag features strongly in the tribes myths and taboos, there will be quite a bit of material on her in Talons of Winter.

Contact with the northernmost Bastanissi would be potentially dangerous, the tribes in this region sometimes conduct raids but some trade is certainly possible. During especially hard times they will endeavour to take captives as sacrifices to the Snow Hag.

JRW
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby rust » Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:11 am

havercake lad wrote: Talons of Winter won't extend the existing map in Secrets of Winter. It will add details for the Yyrisshi Marshlands, Fire Mountains and the Xanardwys Valley.
Thank you very much for these good news. :D
I would imagine that the lands of the Asor are mainly around the coast and that their winters are getting harsher and longer as the climate of the Whitelands expands. ...
The Asor are indeed a coastal culture based upon fishing and
seal hunting, their clans rarely wander a short distance into the
actual Whitelands beyond the coastal region for some hunting
or trapping.

The Snow Hag and the occasionally aggressive Bastanissi tribes
are welcome problems, they will help to make the setting a little
more challenging. :twisted:
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby rust » Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:55 pm

The Asor are also known as "The People of Owl and Wolf",
because their female shamans, the Anganoka, have made
a pact with the animal spirits of owl and wolf as the totem
animals of the Asor. Since the Anganoka lead the clans of
the Asor, and their totem animal is the owl, the owl is also
the symbol of the Asor and their tribal nation Asornok. As
such it also appears on Asornok's flag, which is shown be-
low.
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby DamonJynx » Fri Jan 11, 2013 1:21 am

One of my favourite critters from MM is the Sea-Stag that Urlik Skarsol encounters in Phoenix in Obsidian. They would make an excellent Arctic encounter or two. IIRC they were hunted for sport and their antlers.
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby rust » Fri Jan 11, 2013 10:06 am

DamonJynx wrote:One of my favourite critters from MM is the Sea-Stag that Urlik Skarsol encounters in Phoenix in Obsidian. They would make an excellent Arctic encounter or two. IIRC they were hunted for sport and their antlers.
Thank you for the idea, I will take a look at Phoenix in Obsidian. :D
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby havercake lad » Fri Jan 11, 2013 8:23 pm

DamonJynx wrote:One of my favourite critters from MM is the Sea-Stag that Urlik Skarsol encounters in Phoenix in Obsidian. They would make an excellent Arctic encounter or two. IIRC they were hunted for sport and their antlers.
Indeed..I used this as inspiration to write up the Seabear in 'Secrets' as a hybrid critter rather than a large sealion or polar bear.

More inspiration might be found in 'The Ice Schooner', both for a civilization based on flat icy wastes and for the creatures that they hunt.

Possibly rare, giant (snowy) owls are in remote corners of your world ? Similar to the giant owls in 'To Rescue Tanelorn' and 'Stormbringer'. These beasts are stated in Magic of the Young Kingdoms. (I have written a bit about them myself in some untendered RPG material.)

J
rust
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby rust » Fri Jan 11, 2013 10:16 pm

havercake lad wrote: More inspiration might be found in 'The Ice Schooner', both for a civilization based on flat icy wastes and for the creatures that they hunt.
Thank you for the info, I will put The Ice Schooner on my reading list. :D
Possibly rare, giant (snowy) owls are in remote corners of your world ? Similar to the giant owls in 'To Rescue Tanelorn' and 'Stormbringer'. These beasts are stated in Magic of the Young Kingdoms. (I have written a bit about them myself in some untendered RPG material.)
Giant snowy owls would be considered by the Asor to be manifesta-
tions of the totem spirit of the Anganoka, and I am not sure whether
it would fit into the setting to have such creatures as natural animals
- but I will think about it and keep this option open. :)
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby rust » Sat Jan 12, 2013 9:41 am

Looking at my description of the Asor culture, the list of available
professions is rather short: Craftsman, Fisherman, Hunter and
Shaman (= Anganoka). However, unless I want to ignore about
half of the tribe's population, I will also need a new profession for
those of the tribe's women who are not shamans, with skills like
Craft (Cook), Craft (Tailor), Healing and Teaching. The skill lists
of the other professions will also need some changes. For exam-
ple, a Hunter and even a Craftsman of the Asor needs Survival,
and a Fisherman of the Asor has no use for Swim (swimming in
cold arctic waters is suicidal).
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Re: [Elric] The Whitelands ?

Postby Olaus Petrus » Sun Jan 13, 2013 5:11 pm

rust wrote:
havercake lad wrote: More inspiration might be found in 'The Ice Schooner', both for a civilization based on flat icy wastes and for the creatures that they hunt.
Thank you for the info, I will put The Ice Schooner on my reading list. :D
Possibly rare, giant (snowy) owls are in remote corners of your world ? Similar to the giant owls in 'To Rescue Tanelorn' and 'Stormbringer'. These beasts are stated in Magic of the Young Kingdoms. (I have written a bit about them myself in some untendered RPG material.)
Giant snowy owls would be considered by the Asor to be manifesta-
tions of the totem spirit of the Anganoka, and I am not sure whether
it would fit into the setting to have such creatures as natural animals
- but I will think about it and keep this option open. :)
I don't see why totem animal couldn't also be a natural beast. In real world most totem spirits are based on real natural animals and those animals are seen as incarnation of the totem spirit and kin to the tribe/clan. In Elric natural animals are children of their Beast Lord and Beast Lords are pure essence of the natural animals and if I understand correctly shamanistic religions of Young Kingdoms see their totem animals pretty much the same way as people in real world and for example Valni worship beast spirits (of their totem animals) which are avatars of the Beast Lords. One option could be that Asor owl spirit is avatar of Fileet, Lady of the Birds.

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