5th preview is up

Discover the Legend RPG, Mongoose's fantasy game.
yipwyg
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5th preview is up

Postby yipwyg » Tue Jun 20, 2006 2:33 am

Experience Levels
Creatures
Dragon and Duck Stats. :D

I would appreciate if someone could explain to me how weapon AP vs Armor AP works. I do not remember if this is from old Runequest or if it is from the new version.

Thanks
andakitty
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Postby andakitty » Tue Jun 20, 2006 4:04 am

Oh, this looks very, very good. The 'average' duck looks kind of weak, but no biggy. The artist's conception is good. The dragon and dwarf look about as good as I was hoping. I will now buy the basic rulebook...SOLD. :)

I think we can now say they have integrated actions that are reserved for feats in D&D and integrated them into the rules so that anyone can attempt to do them. Run up a wall! So long as you have the actions, skills, and are not too overloaded. Those are the kind of things that should sell the game to older and younger gamers, hopefully. 8)

The AP is deducted from damage, as far as I know APs don't work against each other. I saw the dragon attacks with AP ratings, at least I suppose that was what AP meant, there. That I cannot explain for certain. It could be the amount of armor that a dragon's bite disregards, as in armor-piercing. Eek! If so that makes them nastier than ever. Half their POW in integrated runes. Eek again. :shock:

Wow, wow, wow. :D
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Postby Lord Twig » Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:20 am

Traditionally the AP next to a weapon is how much damage is blocked by a successful parry. The AP for armor is how much damage is blocked when that location is hit. So a dragon could parry with it's tail and block 8 points of damage then it would block another 12 for whatever location you hit.

I think it is important to note that there are not actually levels. Just guidelines on how powerful you might judge characters to be so you can tell if the challenge of a published adventure would be right for your group.
andakitty
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Postby andakitty » Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:30 am

Traditionally? I don't remember anything like that. Was such a rule in RQ? I have been running Stormbringer, and not doing anything like that. I hope it fades into the background, if so.

I prefer as few steps as reasonably possible...
estarriol
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Re: 5th preview is up

Postby estarriol » Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:32 am

yipwyg wrote:Experience Levels
Creatures
Dragon and Duck Stats. :D

I would appreciate if someone could explain to me how weapon AP vs Armor AP works. I do not remember if this is from old Runequest or if it is from the new version.

Thanks
These are from the monsters part of the main rulebook I hope, for a Gloranthan Dragon the one listed is tough for a dream dragon and weak for a true dragon.

One thing I have noted is the return of the d12 that was removed in 2ed and 3ed, sigh.

Combat also looks nastier now, increased chance of a chest hit.

Finslly s return to one set of hit locations, rather than the 2 from 3rd ed.
andakitty
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Postby andakitty » Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:45 am

The AP's on the weapon charts match so you are most likely right about the number being the amount blocked on a successful parry. It seems kind of clunky and unnecessary, but I should be able to get used to it. Shields are going to be popular, I think. And dodging, if it works that way.

Overall the reviews look like I may have what I wanted, a game to read and enjoy, and play without a lot of houseruling. I can't say I am enthusiastic about all the design decisions but it looks wonderful compared to any other system currently in print.
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Postby Adept » Tue Jun 20, 2006 9:46 am

Promising

The Dragon has _huge_ armour, but at least it's not the rediculous 24 in the RQ-3 creature book. Duck and Dwarf have become rather large (six 9 average) and they've kept the 2d6+6 for average int that screws things up a bit (average stat 10 is more clear and universal).

Still, I must say it looks good.

Oh, and the dragon's firebreath fans out to an insane volume. Half of the length in diamiter? Just imagine how silly that will look. Easy enough to ignore though.
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estarriol
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Postby estarriol » Tue Jun 20, 2006 9:49 am

andakitty wrote:The AP's on the weapon charts match so you are most likely right about the number being the amount blocked on a successful parry. It seems kind of clunky and unnecessary, but I should be able to get used to it. Shields are going to be popular, I think. And dodging, if it works that way.

Overall the reviews look like I may have what I wanted, a game to read and enjoy, and play without a lot of houseruling. I can't say I am enthusiastic about all the design decisions but it looks wonderful compared to any other system currently in print.
Sheilds armour and weapon parries all work the same way, by subtracting the damge the offensive player would deal.
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Postby Adept » Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:21 am

Interesting tidbits there by the way.

It looks like hitpoints have gone up significantly, by something like a factor of two. That is propably a good thing.

I'm still wondering if there will be any wounding penalties. I sure hope so. The lack of such was/is a major flaw in the earlier Rune Quest games.

[I mean penalties that come as soon as you are wounded, before any place has been reduced to 0 HP.]
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homerjsinnott
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Postby homerjsinnott » Tue Jun 20, 2006 12:05 pm

Awww crap! look what they have done to the game.


Running up walls? what kinda nonsense is that?
"there's someone at the door I hope it's not D&D"


Reducing Dwarfs Dex?
"hello D&D, ...what are you doing here?"


Breath flame 1/Hour? why not go the whole hog and make it 1/day.
"I'm afraid you can't, ...come out of there, I never said you could come in"


Double HP.
"D&D you're not going to stay are you? you are! Oh god!!!"


D12?
[sits holding head in hands, quietly weeping.]
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Postby Wulf Corbett » Tue Jun 20, 2006 12:19 pm

homerjsinnott wrote:Running up walls? what kinda nonsense is that?
"there's someone at the door I hope it's not D&D"
Since when could D&D characters run up walls?
Reducing Dwarfs Dex?
"hello D&D, ...what are you doing here?"
Considering how skills are calculated in RQ, what difference does this actually make? A couple of percent here or there, a Strike Rank or two slower. In what way does it resemble D&D?
Breath flame 1/Hour? why not go the whole hog and make it 1/day.
"I'm afraid you can't, ...come out of there, I never said you could come in"
That's a good one, I'll agree...
Double HP.
"D&D you're not going to stay are you? you are! Oh god!!!"
As a former playtester, I can remember 2 different ways that could have come about, and neither have anything to do with D&D. I would have thought the complete lack of Total Hit Points would have been more noticeable...
D12?
[sits holding head in hands, quietly weeping.]
What's wrong with the D12? RQ1 started out with the D12, you should be happy Mongoose is returning to the roots of RQ!

Wulf
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Postby Vadrus » Tue Jun 20, 2006 1:29 pm

Since when have Dwaves and Elves every been able to gain each others trust??

We'll have none of this silly openhandist stuff thank you. Grower and Maker will remain in opposition in my campaigns :twisted:


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SteveMND
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Postby SteveMND » Tue Jun 20, 2006 1:59 pm

*sigh* Ah well. At least I still have the earler editions I can still play with...
andakitty
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Postby andakitty » Tue Jun 20, 2006 4:59 pm

estarriol, I usually play Stormbringer, in which a parry usually blocks all damage. I was comparing oranges and tangerines, or something like that. I understand now.

Buck up, guys! This is nowhere near D&D...I'd be outa here if it was. The hit points will be fine. I play another game with a similar weapon/hit point ratio, Fifth Cycle, and it works. The game looks modular enough to ignore bits you don't like, such as running up a *low* wall. Breath cones and such, well, do they make that much difference?

I think it looks really good. :)
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Postby burdock » Tue Jun 20, 2006 6:01 pm

It all looks great BUT....that is not a dragon. A dragon can squash a whole army simply by yawning and rolling over in its sleep. They have such power that their dreams become manifest in the physical plane......Those statistics MUST be for a Dream Dragon......still, I cant wait!
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homerjsinnott
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Postby homerjsinnott » Tue Jun 20, 2006 6:06 pm

Wulf Corbett wrote:
homerjsinnott wrote:Running up walls? what kinda nonsense is that?
"there's someone at the door I hope it's not D&D"
Since when could D&D characters run up walls?
Acrobats in the old system, I'm sure there must be a feat out there somewhere, I mean if you can fall any distance and not take damage as a monk can...
Wulf Corbett wrote:Reducing Dwarfs Dex?
"hello D&D, ...what are you doing here?"
Considering how skills are calculated in RQ, what difference does this actually make? A couple of percent here or there, a Strike Rank or two slower. In what way does it resemble D&D?
Dex rolls
Improvement rolls
Skill lvl
weapon that you can use
skill lvl ceilings for runepriest, socerers and shamans.
In RQ dwarfs had the same DEX as humans in D&D they don't.

Wulf Corbett wrote:Double HP.
"D&D you're not going to stay are you? you are! Oh god!!!"
As a former playtester, I can remember 2 different ways that could have come about, and neither have anything to do with D&D. I would have thought the complete lack of Total Hit Points would have been more noticeable...
I missed that, Oh! you have only added to my misery!
Wulf Cobett wrote:D12?
[sits holding head in hands, quietly weeping.]
What's wrong with the D12? RQ1 started out with the D12, you should be happy Mongoose is returning to the roots of RQ!
Wulf
Whats wrong with 2D6? which fits better with all the other rolls.
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"I would rather be a Troll than a chimp brained pompous system bigot like you."
It's the system bigot bit I don't understand, and I like chimps.

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Postby SteveMND » Tue Jun 20, 2006 6:11 pm

Burdoc, don't forget that the MGP Runequest is an open-gaming-license product, which means it's specifically designed so that people can use the basic rule mechanics and adapt them to their own campaigns and settings. That means by definition most of the creatures and such in the core book will be a bit "setting-neutral" in that sense.

I fully expect that the Glorantha setting book will have more on True Dragons and such (in fact, it pretty much has to, being set in the time of the EWF!).
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Postby Wulf Corbett » Tue Jun 20, 2006 6:55 pm

homerjsinnott wrote:
Wulf Corbett wrote:Since when could D&D characters run up walls?
Acrobats in the old system, I'm sure there must be a feat out there somewhere, I mean if you can fall any distance and not take damage as a monk can...
Acrobats I bow to your knowledge. The rest... well, sounds like you're inventing problems to me!
Considering how skills are calculated in RQ, what difference does this actually make? A couple of percent here or there, a Strike Rank or two slower. In what way does it resemble D&D?
Dex rolls
So, fewer acrobatic Dwarfs... sounds good to me.
Improvement rolls
Improving what? Skills are improved by rolling over the current skill.
Skill lvl
'lvl'? What level are you talking about?
weapon that you can use
Fewer acrobatic rapier-wielding Dwarfs... better and better!
skill lvl ceilings for runepriest, socerers and shamans.
Assuming they still exist! And by that I mean both the DEX limits and the cult positions...
In RQ dwarfs had the same DEX as humans in D&D they don't.
And now in RQ they don't either.
I would have thought the complete lack of Total Hit Points would have been more noticeable...
I missed that, Oh! you have only added to my misery!
Pay close attention now, there's a quiz at the end!
What's wrong with the D12? RQ1 started out with the D12, you should be happy Mongoose is returning to the roots of RQ!
Whats wrong with 2D6? which fits better with all the other rolls.
But I repeat, what's wrong with the D12?

And these the arguments you have to damn the game? Sounds like you just wanted a verbatim reprint of the old system. It's not. You want the old one, fine, this is the new one. The world moves on. Do you want to move on with it? (that's the quiz, by the way)

Wulf
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Postby Adept » Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:11 pm

homerjsinnott wrote: D12?
[sits holding head in hands, quietly weeping.]
Huh? D12 is cool and underused. It's one of the actual polyhedrons afterall.
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Lord Twig
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Postby Lord Twig » Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:17 pm

Since when do Dwarves in D&D have a lower Dex than humans? In the current 3.x rules Dwarves get +2 Con, -2 Cha. If anything they are making Dwarves different than D&D Dwarves.

I wondered about them not listing total HP. I though maybe they just left it out. If it is not in the game at all it makes me wonder even more about how the combat system is going to work.

I fully expected to get a different game than the older editions. So all of these changes will not change the fact that I am buying the books.

As for running up walls. There is a psionic feat in D&D that allows for it. As for RuneQuest, I seem to recall a Gloranthan hero that could throw a spear then jump on top of it and fly on the spear into battle. So running up a wall for a Hero is no big deal.

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