Gamesmaster Shield

Discover the Legend RPG, Mongoose's fantasy game.
SteveMND
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Postby SteveMND » Mon Jun 19, 2006 12:23 am

Eh; different styles, I suppose. The MGP proposed cover would actually do more for me than the cover you suggested, but either way, the content is what would get me to actually fork over my hard-earned coin.

I find good covers seldom draw me in as much as a poor cover can push me away. In that regard, I'd far rather see something you refer to as 'bulk fantasy' as opposed to something silly, or pandering (I recall some d20 publisher that put out a slew of 'culture' campaign books, and every single one of their covers was a very thin variation on "pretty half-naked girl in a themed bikini holding a weapon against a generic backdrop of said culture").

I actually heard from a couple people that the books weren't that bad, but the cover art they choose really made them (IMHO) look like a fly-by night lowest-common denominator kind of publisher.

In comparison, my favorite cover so far has been the Doraster 'stained glass' cover for RQIII. Actually, I rather liked all the 'thick' campaign book art from the early nineties. They were largely reprints and updates of earlier RQII publications, like Pavis, Shadows on the Borderlands and Sun County, but the covers were intriguing to me. They didn't show any massive battles or typical heroic fights, but rather showed a 'slice of adventurer's life' about the region in question.

To me, that implied a greater level of detail about those sourcebooks than being merely a handful of dry monster stats, and in general that was accurate.

It was a nice change of pace, I think, but at the same time, I kind of doubt they appealed to the mass consumer. Maybe I'm too cynical, but I think 'bulk fantasy' is what your Joe Typical gamer is looking for (and some industry number seem to agree, unfortunately).

RQ always seemed to promote itself towards a different kind of gamer, and as such, it never was an industry leader in terms of sales, but I think I liked it better that way.
Adept
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Postby Adept » Mon Jun 19, 2006 1:18 am

SteveMND wrote:Eh; different styles, I suppose. The MGP proposed cover would actually do more for me than the cover you suggested, but either way, the content is what would get me to actually fork over my hard-earned coin.
That's not quite what I meant. The cover of Lace&Steel says "swashbuckling game, fencing, intrique!" That's what the game is about, so it's a good cover.

The cover of the new RQ:Glorantha book doesn't make me think of Glorantha at all, and I'm a hard core Glorantha fan! It says generic cheesy fantasy.
SteveMND wrote: I find good covers seldom draw me in as much as a poor cover can push me away. In that regard, I'd far rather see something you refer to as 'bulk fantasy' as opposed to something silly, or pandering (I recall some d20 publisher that put out a slew of 'culture' campaign books, and every single one of their covers was a very thin variation on "pretty half-naked girl in a themed bikini holding a weapon against a generic backdrop of said culture").
Have a look at some of the recent Glorantha book covers:

http://www.glorantha.com/products/images/cover1401.jpg

http://www.glorantha.com/products/images/cover1303.jpg

http://www.glorantha.com/products/images/cover1310.jpg

Do you see the difference that I'm trying to illustrate here?

SteveMND wrote: I actually heard from a couple people that the books weren't that bad, but the cover art they choose really made them (IMHO) look like a fly-by night lowest-common denominator kind of publisher.

In comparison, my favorite cover so far has been the Doraster 'stained glass' cover for RQIII. Actually, I rather liked all the 'thick' campaign book art from the early nineties. They were largely reprints and updates of earlier RQII publications, like Pavis, Shadows on the Borderlands and Sun County, but the covers were intriguing to me. They didn't show any massive battles or typical heroic fights, but rather showed a 'slice of adventurer's life' about the region in question.
Yes, those were excellent too. Again, the difference with the "guitar hero vs. Vendigo" we are given this time. :(
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SteveMND
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Postby SteveMND » Mon Jun 19, 2006 3:51 am

Eh, we'll just have to agree to disagree. :) Except for the Borderlands/Sun County etc. covers; it would be nice to see some stuff like that again.
andakitty
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Postby andakitty » Mon Jun 19, 2006 4:28 am

Artwork helps. I look at the Eberron books in the store and really want them...at least until I look at the system again, and remember what else I would have to pick up to make it complete. Damn pretty book. But I guess I remain a substance over looks guy. Those are very nice looking covers you mention, Steve. Does the interior artwork look as good?
RMS
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Postby RMS » Mon Jun 19, 2006 4:50 am

SteveMND wrote:In comparison, my favorite cover so far has been the Doraster 'stained glass' cover for RQIII. Actually, I rather liked all the 'thick' campaign book art from the early nineties. They were largely reprints and updates of earlier RQII publications, like Pavis, Shadows on the Borderlands and Sun County, but the covers were intriguing to me. They didn't show any massive battles or typical heroic fights, but rather showed a 'slice of adventurer's life' about the region in question.
Me too. I especially liked the fact that both Sun County and Shadows on the Borderland included a female adventurer who isn't eye candy in the least, but she does look bad ass. The same is true of the RQ Deluxe cover too. I really liked that cover: simple, but evocative.
RQ always seemed to promote itself towards a different kind of gamer, and as such, it never was an industry leader in terms of sales, but I think I liked it better that way.
Well, for some time RQ was the 2nd biggest seller, until various business decisions torpedoed it.
toothill man
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Postby toothill man » Mon Jun 19, 2006 7:22 am

any idea who is the artist as most have web sites you can ask questions on 8)
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Urox
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Postby Urox » Mon Jun 19, 2006 2:14 pm

Adept wrote:Have a look at some of the recent Glorantha book covers:
While those aren't my favorite pieces, all three are easily recognizable as Gloranthan -- Dragonewt, Buffalo Rider and a female Wind Lord (Kallyr?).

Hrm... If I were designing the cover to the G2A book... off the top of my head, maybe an EWF theme, showing a meeting of great scholar-magicians with the Inhuman King with the Dragon's Eye in the background.
SteveMND
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Postby SteveMND » Mon Jun 19, 2006 2:26 pm

Steve. Does the interior artwork look as good?
All decent. Many in some of the books were taken from the old RQII versions of the publications (such as the Pavis pics, etc.), which I always liked to begin with. I never had all the RQII versions, so I don't know how much was reprints and how much was new stuff, but there was nothing remotely close to the '88 Troll Gods artwork and such.
Me too. I especially liked the fact that both Sun County and Shadows on the Borderland included a female adventurer who isn't eye candy in the least, but she does look bad ass.
I think "not eye candy" doesn't do her justice. That, my friend, is a low APP in action. But yeah, you're right, it was nice to see some 'realistic' people portrayed there. That's part of what made me feel like the sourcebooks were more than just a superficial glossing of numbers and stats.
any idea who is the artist
Shadows, et al. were done by Roger Raupp. Linda Michaels did the Dorastor cover.
Well, for some time RQ was the 2nd biggest seller, until various business decisions torpedoed it.
Well, if the industry leader has some ridiculously overwhelmingly high percentage of the market share, being able to claim you're the the #2 guy only goes so far. I know, I use a Macintosh. :D

That said, whatever traction they may have had back then has been well and truly lost in the d20 resurrgence of the industry. It will be interesting to see how Mongoose is going to handle their OGL RQ. I'll be straight up honest, I don't think they (or anyone else at this point) will ever be able to rival d20 OGL in terms of market share; not even close. But it will be interesting to see how they end up marketing it. Clearly some think they may already be making changes to appeal more to the 'mass market' consumer base, but I'm not sure yet. If they end up doing so, I think that's a huge mistake; since they can't possibly unseat d20 (IMHO), I think they would be best working towards accommodatoing the fans of the system/setting with their publications. I don't think we'll be able to make that assesement until the publications are out, so I'm kinda antcy to see how it goes.

In that regard, I actually liked the three covers Adept didn't. While the first two were admittedly a bit static in their composition, they both very clearly said "RuneQuest." The dragonewt with the runes on his body, the Praxian nomad, etc. I mean, c'mon, a bison-riding barbarian? That is not by any stretch 'generic' fantasy. :) Heck, it even was a re-imagining of the old 2nd edition RuneQuest Companion cover, which clearly shows that somebody there was a die-hard fan...
Adept
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Postby Adept » Mon Jun 19, 2006 3:09 pm

SteveMND wrote: In that regard, I actually liked the three covers Adept didn't. While the first two were admittedly a bit static in their composition, they both very clearly said "RuneQuest." The dragonewt with the runes on his body, the Praxian nomad, etc. I mean, c'mon, a bison-riding barbarian? That is not by any stretch 'generic' fantasy. :) Heck, it even was a re-imagining of the old 2nd edition RuneQuest Companion cover, which clearly shows that somebody there was a die-hard fan...
Hey! I posted those as examples of good and recognizably Gloranthan covers! Especially the "rainbow bridge spirit whorshipper" Bison rider one. That one is a re-make of a very nice cover from the RQ-II era.

English as a second language in action I see. I manage to argue against myself. :O
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SteveMND
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Postby SteveMND » Mon Jun 19, 2006 3:57 pm

Oops, sorry; I stand corrected. Well, that makes things much clearer for me; I kept thinking, "Okay, so what's he got against those? Those sounds like what he's looking for..." :)
estarriol
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Postby estarriol » Mon Jun 19, 2006 4:10 pm

SteveMND wrote:Wow, once again I am stunned by the importance so many are putting into a simple bit of artwork. Reagrdless of whether it's supposed to be a troll or not, it's just one artist's impression of what the creature -- whetever it is -- looks like.

Lord knows we've seen significant changes in how things from RQ have been illustrated by varying artists over the last thirty-odd years. I fail to see how yet one more artist's interpretation will have any real impact on the game itself. :)
Fair enough, but say it is a troll, and then they want to sell me troll figures? Artwork does matter.

What I find odd is that no one from Mongoose Hall appears to know either.
SteveMND
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Postby SteveMND » Mon Jun 19, 2006 4:47 pm

I don't find it all that odd. See my previous post regarding how much info most book cover artists tend to get. :)
estarriol
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Postby estarriol » Mon Jun 19, 2006 5:22 pm

SteveMND wrote:I don't find it all that odd. See my previous post regarding how much info most book cover artists tend to get. :)
You don't find it odd that the people who commissioned it haven't said what it is?

And if thats so, I have this nice bridge here for sale............
SteveMND
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Postby SteveMND » Mon Jun 19, 2006 6:10 pm

You don't find it odd that the people who commissioned it haven't said what it is?
Not at all. Mongoose is hella busy these days, especially with the summer gaming con season upon us.

I doubt anyone's noticed the question here on the forum, much less looked into tracking down the person that originaly sent the artwork blurb out to find out what it was described as :).
estarriol
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Postby estarriol » Mon Jun 19, 2006 6:49 pm

SteveMND wrote:
You don't find it odd that the people who commissioned it haven't said what it is?
Not at all. Mongoose is hella busy these days, especially with the summer gaming con season upon us.

I doubt anyone's noticed the question here on the forum, much less looked into tracking down the person that originaly sent the artwork blurb out to find out what it was described as :).
The forum has a moderator, I am fairly sure its been seen, and its not as though I asked and wanted an answer the same day.

It seems a fair enough question, this book and Gm shield they want to sell me, what is the picture on them?
GbajiTheDeceiver
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Postby GbajiTheDeceiver » Mon Jun 19, 2006 7:42 pm

estarriol wrote:
SteveMND wrote:I don't find it all that odd. See my previous post regarding how much info most book cover artists tend to get. :)
You don't find it odd that the people who commissioned it haven't said what it is?

And if thats so, I have this nice bridge here for sale............
Have a look under it, and you should very quickly find the answer to your question. :lol:

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