What are Suppression Dice?

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What are Suppression Dice?

Postby hithero » Sun May 11, 2008 12:44 pm

As the title say's; the only place I can find reference to these is in some units special rules, but what are they? Is it dice that do not score a hit i.e. 2's and 3's? The Para's for example ignore the 1st Suppression dice and so do the SS but the SS also discard all Suppression dice :? Do they discard 1 or all? Or do the rules actually mean that the unit ignores its first (or all) suppressed actions?
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Agis
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Postby Agis » Sun May 11, 2008 3:05 pm

Please re-read P. 39. If it is still unclear, let me know.
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Postby Stingray » Sun May 11, 2008 3:16 pm

Does it mean that it ignores the first dice that would cause suppression (ie any dice that hits)? Would that work the same with your suggested rule (ie that all dice except natural 1s count towards suppression)?

The same paragraph on p39 also implies that being out of commmand causes a lost action. But if you'e out of command you can only react (p10). Is this a misprint referring to a previous iteration of the rules?
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Postby hithero » Sun May 11, 2008 5:57 pm

Agis wrote:Please re-read P. 39. If it is still unclear, let me know.
Still confused "Suppression Dice" are not mentioned at all! damage Dice are and so is Suppression, but not Suppression Dice. I know how suppression works from playing BFE, but not how these units special rules effect it.
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Postby Hiromoon » Sun May 11, 2008 6:11 pm

The damage dice and suppression dice are one in the same. The amount of dice you roll that do not come up as ones are counted as suppression dice.
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Postby soulman » Sun May 11, 2008 6:14 pm

Basic rules - No suppression used, remoce all dice that are not hits, which are 3 or under, its only 4+ that you place against hit targets..

Advanced rules - all dice but 1`s are placed against target figures, if each figure has a dice against it, then its suppressed, if it happens a second time, they are suppressed twice, and lose 2 actions next turn.

Special rules :some units can forget the first time they are suppressed each turn, so if a unit like SS are suppressed twice in one turn, you remove 1, so its only have once suppression against it for that turn...

Hope that helps and of course make some sense

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Postby Agis » Sun May 11, 2008 7:58 pm

To make thinks clearer:

P. 39 - Suppression
Please add the following sentence and example to the text:
If every model in a unit is allocated a Damage Dice, even a Damage Dice that does not score a hit, in a single Shoot action, then it will immediately lose its next action, and may only Move as a reaction.

Example: A British Rifle Fire Team is shooting from 20” at a German Grenadier Fire Team (full 5 man) that foolishly is caught in the open (no obscurement, no cover). Since the Sten SMG is out of range only the 6 Lee-Enfield rifles are shooting. The British player rolls 6 dice and comes up with 1, 3, 4, 4, 5 and 6 – good shoot-ing!
The 1 is discarded; all other damage dice are allocated. The German unit is suppressed and loses its next action. In addition one Grenadier is removed (kill score) and 3 Grenadiers have to roll equal or greater then their Save score to survive.
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Postby Stingray » Sun May 11, 2008 9:13 pm

Okay, let's keep it simple: how exactly does the 'Fearless' trait work? The text says that it allows a unit 'to discard the first Suppression dice it suffers every turn' (pages 48,55,76). Does this mean the unit can ignore one of the dice that would count towards causing Suppression (minor effect), or that it can discard the first Suppression counter (ie lost action next turn) it receives each turn? So in effect you need to cause 3 hits per model to make the unit lose 2 actions next turn (rather than 2 hits/ model for normal troops).
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Postby hithero » Sun May 11, 2008 9:28 pm

Precisely, for some reason our question still cannot be answered, and why add in the confusion of suppression dice when its not explained what it is? So a suppression dice are all those that don't roll a 1.

So how does Fearless work especially in the case of the SS where their rules Fearless and Fanatic rules contradict each other! Do they:
a) ignore 1 suppression dice
b) ignore the first suppression
c) ignore all suppression dice
d) ignore both supressions
e) ignore all suppression dice and therefore all suppressions.
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Postby Stingray » Sun May 11, 2008 9:37 pm

It looks like only the SS Command Squad get 'Fanatic'.
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Postby hithero » Sun May 11, 2008 9:43 pm

Yes, I guess that the Fearless special rule is there in error?
Soulman/Hiromoon, are your answers 'official' or educated guesses based on BFE?
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Postby Agis » Mon May 12, 2008 8:43 am

Guys keep in mind that ONLY Matt can answer questions officially!
:!: The last word as far as the rules are concerned is ALWAYS from him. :!:

SS contradiction: IMO no problem here, all SS units are Fearless and only the Command squad and the Snipers are fanatic. :idea:

Fearless: Take my above mentioned example and read it this way:
Example: A British Rifle Fire Team is shooting from 20” at a German SS Fire Team (full 5 man) that foolishly is caught in the open (no obscurement, no cover). Since the Sten SMG is out of range only the 6 Lee-Enfield rifles are shooting. The British player rolls 6 dice and comes up with 1, 3, 4, 4, 5 and 6 – good shoot-ing!
The 1 is discarded; all other damage dice are allocated. The SS unit is not suppressed since the unit is fearless and discards the 1st suppression dice its gets. Still one Soldier is removed (kill score) and 3 Soldiers have to roll equal or greater then their Save score to survive.

If the German SS unit would be a Command unit it would discard all suppression dice but still would have one Soldier removed (kill score) and 3 Soldiers to roll equal or greater then their Save score to survive.

OK? 8)
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hithero
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Postby hithero » Mon May 12, 2008 12:53 pm

So it is just one dice that is removed then? for example:
The targeted SS squad has 5 members, and recieve 6 hits after removing ones.
The 'Fearless' SS unit removes 1 Suppression dice and so is still suppressed.

Yes?
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Postby Agis » Mon May 12, 2008 1:14 pm

hithero wrote:So it is just one dice that is removed then? for example:
The targeted SS squad has 5 members, and recieve 6 hits after removing ones.
The 'Fearless' SS unit removes 1 Suppression dice and so is still suppressed.

Yes?
Yes.

Please re-read the rule again:
Fearless: The unit discards the first Suppression dice it suffers every turn.
cheers and keep on gaming, Agis
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Postby hithero » Wed May 21, 2008 11:30 am

I've played several games now with SS and Para's but am finding this trait next to useless as it only has an effect if the number of suppression dice equals the number of model in the unit. If the unit suffers more suppression dice than it has models, then it is still suppressed; if it suffers less supression dice then it has no effect. It would be better if the Fearless unit removed a suppression dice every time it was fired at, at least that way there is more chance of its use.
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Postby MongooseMatt » Wed May 21, 2008 1:36 pm

Hi guys,

Just to let you know we are currently preparing a BF Evo: WaW Player's Guide PDF, which will answer a lot of your questions on this and other subjects!
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