Creating a Temptress character

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LilithsThrall
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Postby LilithsThrall » Sun Feb 22, 2009 8:55 pm

Speaking of the concept, witches are often portrayed as consorts to demons. Would that sort of thing work in the world of conan or are demons too alien for that?
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Postby LilithsThrall » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:28 pm

Spectator wrote: I always found the Temptress to be a doofus class.
At least in the first edition, they could not take sorcery stuff, but from reading how the 2nd edition class descriptions is, I guess they are trying to allow for a psuedo-sorceror.

Sorry, Vincent, I hope you don't take offense, I just think that as a class it is akin to the "Bard" from AD+D.
I think the Temptress makes a very cool assassin and poison use, via Sorcerous Garden, compensates very well for lack of sneak attack.
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Postby Clovenhoof » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:31 pm

Well, basically any kind of sorcerer with a Demonic Pact is possible. However, if you are thinking of a Temptress with the Summoning Style, that wouldn't make much sense, because the core rules have only one single Advanced Spell that the Temptress can qualify for. So the other slots would be lost.
Of course, you can always make a Scholar character, with or without Summoning, and call her a Witch. That's just a matter of background.

--

For our upcoming campaign however, the basic concept is that the female character starts out as the Barbarian's slave. (Incidentally, I play the Barb and the other player is my girlfriend.) So we think the Temptress class would be a good fit for that.
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Postby LilithsThrall » Sun Feb 22, 2009 10:30 pm

I'd like to point out that men as well as women can be Tempters/Temptresses and that the 2nd ed book states, "While the majority of temptresses use sex as their primary weapon, they can also be political power brokers, crime lords, or even sorceresses". I take this to mean that Temptresses are meant to be characters actively and aggressively engaged in life, not dominant submissives doing the best they can on their backs. Examples from literature would include Inara from Firefly, James Bond, and James T Kirk. Every one of these characters is an alpha male/female capable of handling themselves in combat and capable of getting the job done.
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Postby Ichabod » Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:01 pm

Could rename temptress manipulatress ... or maybe not.

But, anyway, if you think of the class as a manipulator, it broadens it some. Personally, I think the class is ridiculous, being way too narrow a concept. Might make sense as a prestige class since Conan PCs seem incredibly narrow.

If I wasn't forced to take borderer levels until my character explodes, I would have taken a level of tempter, partially for humor value, partially because I doubted any other player would ever take levels in the class, partially because +2 Will saves isn't so bad.
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Postby LilithsThrall » Mon Feb 23, 2009 12:58 am

Ichabod wrote:Could rename temptress manipulatress ... or maybe not.

But, anyway, if you think of the class as a manipulator, it broadens it some. Personally, I think the class is ridiculous, being way too narrow a concept. Might make sense as a prestige class since Conan PCs seem incredibly narrow.

If I wasn't forced to take borderer levels until my character explodes, I would have taken a level of tempter, partially for humor value, partially because I doubted any other player would ever take levels in the class, partially because +2 Will saves isn't so bad.
This seems to be all too common. A great concept which doesn't seem to have been playtested. While the class flavor does indicate that the class doesn't have to depend on sex, so many of the powers only affect targets who are sexually attracted to the character.
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Postby Dark Mistress » Mon Feb 23, 2009 2:43 am

I think it is a ok class, i think it should be more focused as a social thief type able to fill the same roll as a thief maybe not as good but more social to make up for it. They do make lovely assassins though.
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Postby Voltumna » Mon Feb 23, 2009 4:14 am

Dark Mistress wrote:I think it is a ok class, i think it should be more focused as a social thief type able to fill the same roll as a thief maybe not as good but more social to make up for it. They do make lovely assassins though.
Totally agree on that. One think that deters players from taking levels in it is that it is too sexually focused.
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Postby Dark Mistress » Mon Feb 23, 2009 5:57 am

Voltumna wrote:
Dark Mistress wrote:I think it is a ok class, i think it should be more focused as a social thief type able to fill the same roll as a thief maybe not as good but more social to make up for it. They do make lovely assassins though.
Totally agree on that. One think that deters players from taking levels in it is that it is too sexually focused.
yeah i guess as a girl that doesn't bother me as much. i mean to me it makes a lot of sense. I mean i can't think of a easier way to kill a guy than to attract him sexually and wait to catch him when he least expects it and is most distracted. So as assassins they make a lot of sense. Also the class has a similar feel as the Companions of the tv Series Firefly and the movie Serenity by Josh Wheadon too.
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Postby tarkhan bey » Mon Feb 23, 2009 8:59 am

As far as nationality goes for your temptress, why not go for a Brythunian? Everyone regards them as "dumb blondes"(no offence to blondes out there :) )
She could be playing the typical dumb blonde wench but really be a conniving schemer and she would be much less obvious than a Zingaran or Zamorian in a similar role.
Just a thought.
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Postby sgstyrsky » Mon Feb 23, 2009 3:31 pm

There are two good examples of how a temptress could be played, both from pastiche novels.

The first is Lakhme from "Conan the Marauder". She is the typical schemer, playing several side against each other, but also so much more. She has the ability to get men to kill each other for her, and she is also quick with the poisoned blade.

The second is Isparana from the "Sword of Skelos". She's definitely possesses some of the class's skills at seduction and manipulation, but is also good with a sword.

I recommend the two novels to anyone who might play a temptress PC.
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Postby Clovenhoof » Mon Mar 09, 2009 1:22 am

Just a little heads up on this front:

Concerning the Temptress, the GM said he'd prefer the group to be mundane, so she's gonna go the Thievery route after all, so all that magic discussion was much ado about nothing I'm afraid. ;)

Anyway, we started the new campaign today and it was a lot of fun. =) We're a Cimmerian Barbarian, a Zingaran Temptress and a Zingaran Pirate. I probably won't be able to keep a Diary of Sessions, but we'll see. ^^
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Postby Dark Mistress » Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:24 am

Pity would have been interesting to see how it went.
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Postby Clovenhoof » Tue Mar 10, 2009 1:04 am

Anyway, she is - currently - a very useful group member; not only does she handle all the social interaction with neutral/friendly NPCs (down to haggling for bigger rewards), she also holds surprisingly well in combat, being pretty much on par with the Pirate concerning attack, damage and defense.
Actually both of them out-damaged the Barbarian, because they have Sneak Attack (with Zingaran bonus, too) and the Barb doesn't have PA yet.

Of course that will change on higher levels (we were level 3 during this adventure), but the original idea of her staying out of combat entirely is pretty much off the table; she's simply too effective for that. From level 7 on (I think) she'll be able to Feint as a Free Action, so she'll be able to Sneak Attack a lot.
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Postby Vortigern » Tue Mar 10, 2009 4:45 pm

Just hope the rest of the group doesn't get envious of your lady-friend benefiting from your character design prowess more than they do. :wink:
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Postby Clovenhoof » Tue Mar 10, 2009 5:56 pm

Well, there's just three PCs in the group, and I'm also assisting the other player to skill his Pirate properly. Basically it looks like the Temptress is going to be as effective a fighter as any, as long as she doesn't get hit.

As for my Barbarian, I'm unsure if I should skill him into the Strength/Reckless Attack/Cleave direction or rather the Dex/Greater Combat Reflexes idea. (There's not enough feat slots for both.) I can delay the decisive choices a bit, but by 6th level I'll have to make the call.
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Postby Apple » Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:26 pm

Clovenhoof wrote:Of course that will change on higher levels (we were level 3 during this adventure), but the original idea of her staying out of combat entirely is pretty much off the table; she's simply too effective for that. From level 7 on (I think) she'll be able to Feint as a Free Action, so she'll be able to Sneak Attack a lot.

Improved Feint is a move action. Did you mean move or is there a way to get it for free?

There is a feat that gives charisma bonus to parry, don't recall that name right now, but it's a part of a lot of crazy defence builds. Could be worthwhile for a temptress if she's using a shield. If she isn't using a shield then a level of soldier for the extra feat and the two weapon fighting is pretty obvious if she continues to spend a lot of time on the front line. Not to mention the extra HPs, better armour choices, base attack and the +2 fort for those massive damage rolls and poisons.
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Postby Clovenhoof » Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:48 am

IIRC, a Temptress with Thievery as Secret Art gets a special ability that enables her to Feint as a Free Action once per round - for instance by flashing certain parts of her body.

A Soldier/Temptress with a Shield, well that would be a good fit for an Amazon. But I don't think that's the direction the player wants to go. Without Shield, her maximum Parry (with Intricate Swordplay) won't be better than her maximum Dodge, but cost more feats.
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Postby Vambelte » Thu Mar 12, 2009 2:25 pm

For a temptress to feint as free action, due to her class ability, it is ok for me. But I really dislike the feat that alows a feint as a free action. Greater feint, described in Hyborias fallen, even beeing really hard to get, isn't balanced at all. It basically gives a high chance to kill everyone around you, whit great cleave, in a round. Or kill 3 oponents whit sneak attacks, since the feat asks for BAB11+. Hell you can even feint the vilain and attack him 3+ times whit PA or SA, and sudenly that powerfull NPC went down in a single round of one PC.
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Clovenhoof
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Postby Clovenhoof » Thu Mar 12, 2009 2:49 pm

That's easily nerfed. Just say that even if you can feint as a Free Action, you can only do so _once per round_, affecting _one opponent_. The idea should be to be able to either move, feint and attack once in the same round, or feint one opponent and launch a Full Attack against him.

Note that a Temptress can be skilled to receive an additional bonus of 1/2 her class level to Bluff. Now imagine the kind of Feint check she gets.

So the quintessence is that a Temptress can very easily kill one human male opponent per round. Note that to do so, she can't wear armour.
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