pc problems some help please

Discuss Mongoose RPGs here, such as the OGL rulebooks, Jeremiah, Armageddon 2089 and Macho Women with Guns
User avatar
Shadow Queen
Cosmic Mongoose
Posts: 4973
Joined: Sun Feb 20, 2005 5:08 pm
Location: Frome, Somerset, UK
Contact:

pc problems some help please

Postby Shadow Queen » Wed Dec 20, 2006 3:46 pm

I have a couple of questions about Babylon 5:
Is it set before, during or after the series?
If the PCs are in a spaceship that gets attacked and
one of the PCs messes up piloting/gunnery or somesuch
catastrophically, what happens?
If one of the PCs meets, say Garibaldi or Sheridan and
shoots them in the back of the head, what happens?
How are a Narn and a Centauri going to be able to
operate together in the same group?
Cheers,
Toby
Christ's Blessings

Doesn't this create a few problems?
First: There's such a strong story arc in Babylon 5
that if it's set at this point PCs are pretty
pointless, they're just bit players or window
dressing.
Or
Secondly: Back to the Sheridan example, shoot Sheridan
and The Shadows win, the story arc is destroyed, EF
will have bigger problems to worry about.....
--- DerinaJean@aol.com wrote:

> at the start of the second seasion

Yes, sure. That doesn't stop the PCs having no real
motivation though, it just makes them decoration in
the bigger picture if they can't alter events.
And if they can alter events then there's every chance
it could mess up the overall story arc.

DerinaJean@aol.com wrote:

> it is to be kept cannon what you know your pc wont
> know
“What do you hear?”
“Nothing but the rain,”
“Then grab your gun and bring in the cat,”

All painting Work on my photobucket is copywrite Derina Ramsey please ask if you wish to use.
thedarkelf007
Mongoose
Posts: 105
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 2:43 am
Location: Canberra, Australia

Postby thedarkelf007 » Wed Dec 20, 2006 10:29 pm

What I would do in this situation is tell the players directly they can influence and change the course of the B5 storyline.

But...

If they alter it they risk not knowing what is going to happen from the moment they change thing.

Killing Sherridan before he goes to Za'ha'dum means that the shadows destroy B5 (if the vorlons have attack them earlier).

I find this is a good motivator to avoid killing key characters, though I do like it when characters are trying to make sure the cannon storyline still happens because of something they did wrong earlier.

Think of the Star Wars Infinities storylines, what if... happens, then the theme still happens, but the players are different, and the events are changed.

This line of thinking simply requires more work on the GM's part to keep track of how the changes have affected the universe.
-------
Martin

Longterm GM and loves the 2nd Ed B5 rules
User avatar
frobisher
Duck-Billed Mongoose
Posts: 2046
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 12:41 pm
Location: Glenfarg, SCOTLAND

Postby frobisher » Thu Dec 21, 2006 1:16 am

PCs only need the illusion of free will. Yes, they could shoot and kill Sheriden, but it's not going to happen. What would they be doing armed around Sheriden in the first place? If they are station personel then they wouldn't be shooting Sheriden now would they? If they are not station personel, they aren't going to get into that situation.

As regards Narn/Centauri cooperation, all I need do is point you towards Londo and G'Kar and that should be foundation enough.

But unlike D&D, parties in Babylon should not be random assemblages of random characters just because you can roll such and such up according to the rules. The GM has to veto ideas that are designed to torpedo the party dynamic ("No, you can't have a Technomage..."), and has to encourage character concepts that promote it ("A libertarian Centauri who likes Narn you say..?").
Paddy Sinclair

Us Yellowbeards are never more dangerous than when we're dead...
Gabriel_Luna
Banded Mongoose
Posts: 308
Joined: Thu Nov 02, 2006 8:09 am

Postby Gabriel_Luna » Thu Dec 21, 2006 8:51 am

I think there are lots of ways to handle this, but the two I recommend are similar. Either let them play a part "off screen", or keep them away from canon altogether.

Take the way Galen was used in the Technomage books as an example. (I assume SQ's read them...) In the show, Sheirdan went from shooting a Shadow to being over the hole to Lorien. "How did he get there?" we ask, and in the book, that is filled in. Galen helped him.

If the PCs want to effect canon, let them. How did Sheridan know that Coriana Six was next on the Vorlon's hit list? Hyperspace isn't linear, after all. Perhaps the PCs helped out by risking their lives for the cause. Maybe you let them help Lyta when she's on the run, ensuring her survival. Maybe they helped Marcus escape his home when the Shadows attacked. Maybe they were the ones who took down N'Grath after season 1. What about the Proxima resistance? How did they fare before Sheridan's fleet arrived? There are all sorts of events that the PCs could have a pivotal role in, allowing them to contribute to canon (or not).

And if they're contrary, there are plenty of places they can act against the main characters. ISN reporters, for example, or Nightwatch recruits on one of the colonies.

Alternately, you could just keep them out of the way for the big events. It's a big galaxy out there, after all. If they aren't on B5 that often, they won't be thinking about shooting Sheridan. (Though any player who wants to kill the main characters just because is one I'd watch closely anyway...) Keep them moving, keep them pointed at planets or space stations that never even appeared in the show. There's plenty of plot without having to tell them "you can't do that, it's canon". Though I wouldn't recommend telling them that anyway.

I'd recommend asking them what sort of game they want to play in, and then making the game appear to be that. If they want total free will to alter canon, tell them they can, and then don't give them the chance. If they want canon written in stone, well then make sure they hear about all the events in a timely fashion, but keep them busy so they don't feel pointless.

Anyway, sorry to ramble. I hope that helps.
"Why not," said Ford, "go mad?"
R Arceneaux
Mongoose
Posts: 133
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 7:06 pm

possibilities....

Postby R Arceneaux » Thu Dec 21, 2006 1:07 pm

I have a couple of questions about Babylon 5:

Is it set before, during or after the series?

As a GM it is you who determine that. Your primary time line could start before B5 came on line--say an investigation of what happend to B4 or why the first three stations went boom?

You might have to adjust a bit for tecnology such as older transports and ships but I would say that the initial plot line is up to you and what you think your players will consider interesting enough to get enthused about playing.

Lol, of course where the plot line leades ultimately depends on the players actions and interactions does it not?


If the PCs are in a spaceship that gets attacked and
one of the PCs messes up piloting/gunnery or somesuch
catastrophically, what happens?

Our group does a little thing to determine the result of a fumbled roll of the dice. We roll a d4. The first die roll determines the severity and ranges from minor (1) to major mess up (4). The second d4 gives the GM the specific type of disaster to invent (1) perhaps a simple miscalculation aka a miss. Or a 4 being a major catastrophic event (say a jam for a few rounds or a complete failure due to something).

The d4 dice toss makes a mess up 'Interesting'.


If one of the PCs meets, say Garibaldi or Sheridan and
shoots them in the back of the head, what happens?

WELL obviously if they fail a check to hear and or sense them (telepath) then obviously the effects are going to be terminal. HOWEVER, IF I remember correctly, PPGs did not have a stun setting. Then too the PC could say 'drop your weapon and attempt to take prisoners. OR outside circumstances, say a ship moving may jolt the hand of the shooter causing a possibility of a missed shot. The possibilites of events are endless.

So your selection of circumstances would in fact depend largly on the setting of the battle or fight as you present it and now much your players are willing to set aside normality for the sake of game enjoytment.



How are a Narn and a Centauri going to be able to
operate together in the same group?

When two natural quareling groups have a 'Common' enemy it is not within the realms of impossibility that they can set aside disputes to fight a greater common foe. Its all a matter of diplomacy is it not?

R Arceneaux
Bester was right.
The universe belongs to the superior species.
User avatar
Shadow Queen
Cosmic Mongoose
Posts: 4973
Joined: Sun Feb 20, 2005 5:08 pm
Location: Frome, Somerset, UK
Contact:

Postby Shadow Queen » Thu Dec 21, 2006 6:20 pm

start of the second season
“What do you hear?”
“Nothing but the rain,”
“Then grab your gun and bring in the cat,”

All painting Work on my photobucket is copywrite Derina Ramsey please ask if you wish to use.
thedarkelf007
Mongoose
Posts: 105
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 2:43 am
Location: Canberra, Australia

Postby thedarkelf007 » Thu Dec 21, 2006 9:41 pm

The problem with saying you allow cannon to be effected, and then not allowing them to is it will frustrate players to leave...

Just make the price for such an action outweight the benifit, and that allows the "free will" campaign by making them choose...

Such as the concepts of

- Who are you
- What do you want

and if one does manage to kill a main character, well then that's murder and if they left any evidence, then if they survive the capture they will either have their personality wiped, or outright killed...

Or they have to take on the resposiblity for the cannon they have changed, with the penalty for failure being the destruction of the party...

Railroading while keeping the GM happy, should be done as a last resort and a reactive tool when you know there are no other options left.

just my thoughts.
-------
Martin

Longterm GM and loves the 2nd Ed B5 rules

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 23 guests