Ship Minis?

Discuss Mongoose RPGs here, such as the OGL rulebooks, Jeremiah, Armageddon 2089 and Macho Women with Guns
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Postby Greg Smith » Thu Apr 15, 2004 9:13 pm

nitflegal wrote: Actually, those minis are awfully hard to come by today.

matt
No they aren't. Agent One is still selling them. http://www.agentsofgaming.com/oshop.htm
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Postby nitflegal » Thu Apr 15, 2004 9:29 pm

Greg Smith wrote:
nitflegal wrote: Actually, those minis are awfully hard to come by today.

matt
No they aren't. Agent One is still selling them. http://www.agentsofgaming.com/oshop.htm
Umm, I don't think so. That's their old sale list, if you follow it to the homepage you will see the announcement that orders ended a year and a half ago. Bruce had to sell what he could and destroy the rest when the license got yanked from him. He even had to turn over an destoy all computer files and what have you (one reason that all of the AoG developed CGI models that they did are gone forever, WB destroyed them). AoG hasn't been able to take orders or produce prouct since Nov, 2002.

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Postby slingbld » Thu Apr 15, 2004 9:34 pm

Be carefull!
at www.agentsofgaming.com they mention that elements of thier website will remain active but they also mention not realy being able to take any orders after 11/2/02.

I would be carefull when looking through the order page.
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Postby DKeith2011 » Thu Apr 15, 2004 10:36 pm

Actually the whole story is...

Bruce (Agent 1) bought out the old AOG inventory from several distributors early last year and has been selling them quite legally ever since.

I have ordered over $500 worth of stuff myself (at thats at about a 25% discount or more).

For full details look at the "Would Anybody Buy Miniatures?" thread in the "General Discussion" forum at B5Wars.net.

Basically you contact Bruce via email (its in the thread) or by post in the above thread to see if he has the items you want, if so you place the order on the AOG store site.

He is generally even willing to take installment payments and do lay-aways on large orders.


Hope that helps.
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Postby nitflegal » Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:05 pm

DKeith2011 wrote:Actually the whole story is...

Bruce (Agent 1) bought out the old AOG inventory from several distributors early last year and has been selling them quite legally ever since.

I have ordered over $500 worth of stuff myself (at thats at about a 25% discount or more).

For full details look at the "Would Anybody Buy Miniatures?" thread in the "General Discussion" forum at B5Wars.net.

Basically you contact Bruce via email (its in the thread) or by post in the above thread to see if he has the items you want, if so you place the order on the AOG store site.

He is generally even willing to take installment payments and do lay-aways on large orders.


Hope that helps.
You are correct, and I should have clarified. He does have a bunch of holes though, especially books. It might just be unluckiness but when I've aksed him about varous min availabilities (usually League) he's almost always out of stock.

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Postby Jal » Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:20 pm

yep Agent 1 is still selling them, god knows how much money i spent on buying several loads off him last year. :roll:

they are going to get even more scarce as time goes on, they are a finite resource and there are only so many shops that had stock that could be bought back by Bruce, for which i and many other people thank him. :D

i think remaking all of the moulds just to get a 20% increase in the size of the F.A. scale would be a waste of money and unless they also did every ship that aog made it would mess up everything by having three distinct scales for the ships.

at the end of the day this is a tie in to a RPG game and not a dedicated miniatures company, it all depends on the possible returns on their investments.
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Postby DKeith2011 » Fri Apr 16, 2004 12:43 am

jal wrote:yep Agent 1 is still selling them, god knows how much money i spent on buying several loads off him last year. :roll:

they are going to get even more scarce as time goes on, they are a finite resource and there are only so many shops that had stock that could be bought back by Bruce, for which i and many other people thank him. :D

i think remaking all of the moulds just to get a 20% increase in the size of the F.A. scale would be a waste of money and unless they also did every ship that aog made it would mess up everything by having three distinct scales for the ships.

at the end of the day this is a tie in to a RPG game and not a dedicated miniatures company, it all depends on the possible returns on their investments.
Looks like Bruce is eyeing another buy-back, not sure about quantity or variety.

And if any B5 ships are to be made it would require new molds, the ones AOG was using were destroyed as part of the shutdown.
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Postby Lane Shutt » Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:47 am

DKeith2011 wrote: if any B5 ships are to be made it would require new molds, the ones AOG was using were destroyed as part of the shutdown.
Remaking the molds would not be that difficult for someone with experience and the right equipment/ materials.

Take a well cast mini (little flash, close mold lines, no warpage) and make an RTV mold.
Cast in resin.
Clean up the casting for use as a new master.
Use the resculpted resin master to make master mold.
Cast first generation metal minis, IIRC GW uses tin to get best quality.
Use first gen minis to make production molds.
Start production.

The first two steps could be done in a little over a day.
Cleaning up/ resculpting should be faster than starting from scratch.

There are resins out there which can be used to shrink or expand the cast part. Size change could be done by adding an extra casting/ molding cycle. Think near B5 Wars detail on minis slightly larger than Fleet Action, the only reason for less detail is the limits of the metal casting.

This all assumes they can use the designs, may require consent or paying the sculptors.
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Postby Jal » Fri Apr 16, 2004 11:29 am

if any B5 ships are to be made it would require new molds, the ones AOG was using were destroyed as part of the shutdown.
ahh, i didn`t remember that bit. :wink:

though having to rebuild my collection in a different scale will be a real bummer. :(

by the way, i`m still trying to get my hands on a 1:1 scale Starfury. :wink: :lol:
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Postby ShadowScout » Fri Apr 16, 2004 2:40 pm

Scale... well, rebuilding the AoG mini line would be possible even if WB really didn't keep one master per mini "for the record" (though one'd have to tell them that was a stupid move - they ought to have had AoG turn everything over at the end of their license time, and keep it for themselves, available for new license-holders at request and with maybe a little extra cash to offset the storage costs... but most of all, to have it available to keep THEIR options open) Well, anyway, as it was outlined by Lane Shutt above, redoing molds from existing minis isn't that hard (I knew a couple of guys who did it with a different mini line - of course, without license it's quite illegal, so don't try that at home, guys!).

And I'd really say Mongoose ought to do that.

The AoG scales were good - FA was just right for big fleet battles (though some of the small medium ship minis were a bit too small - they always hopped off their stands because they didn't have the "depth" to add a metal pin like I did with all the other minis for hard-game stability...), FS for RPG encounters (though some of the really big capship minis were a bit too big - however, the visual impact they made on a scene as "fleet flagship" was simply great! And worth the effort it took me to get them on a single stand...).
BtW, the Harlequin character mini scale was great too - like the oly Ral Partha fantasy minis, 25 mm IIRC. The perfect size for a game, without looking as "overgrown" as certain 28 mm mini lines...

So, I'd suggest if Mongoose ever gets into it, they ought to do what they can to resurrect the old mini lines and build from them - that would also have the added benefit that people with AQoG minis could continue their fleet buildup where they left off, and wouldn't become annoyed that they'd have to re-purchase everything (I do know a few who think "oh, no - I won't, can't spend all that cash -again- just to get where I was last year... better forget about it all...")

Hmmm... I just had a thought... it certainly is also possible to rebuild some of the AoG CGI stuff - after all, some of it was made by third-party artists, and they could recreate the work they did for AoG (they might even have some old in-work files from their old AoG contracts still floating around to help them with that one - maybe) And if not, there are a few talented CGI guys who could be contracted by Mongoose to recreate the meshes anyway, just from the pix and minis AoG did with them...
So in the end it's just a matter of cost. If Mongoose sells enough B5 RPG books to make it worth their while to invest in that, and they hear their customers would like it done, they probably will do it.
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Harliquin Minis

Postby Max_Writer » Fri Apr 16, 2004 8:18 pm

Does anyone know anywhere to get the old Harlequin minis?
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Postby Golem2176 » Fri Apr 16, 2004 8:43 pm

When will the minis hit the shelves?
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Re: Harliquin Minis

Postby Greg Smith » Sat Apr 17, 2004 12:30 pm

Max_Writer wrote:Does anyone know anywhere to get the old Harlequin minis?
http://www.feltongames.com/ is a gold-mine of old figures. They have 7 boxes listed.
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Postby ronbogard » Sat Apr 17, 2004 2:22 pm

Thats cool thanks Grey Smith but I cant make out what figures are in each box.
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Postby ShadowScout » Sat Apr 17, 2004 3:25 pm

ronbogard wrote:Thats cool thanks Grey Smith but I cant make out what figures are in each box.
Maybe an list would help... let's see...

B 5101 - B5 Series 1 Collectors Box 1
Commander Sinclair
Carolyn Sykes
Ko’Dath
Security Guard
Rouge Soul Hunter


B 5102 - B5 Series 1 Collectors Box 2
Ambassador Londo Mollari
Adira Tyree
Trakis
Medical Technician
Soul Hunter


B 5103 - B5 Series 1 Collectors Box 3
Lt.Cmr. Susan Ivanova
Catherine Sakai
Tu’Pari
Dr. Vance Hendriks
Infected Nelson Drake


B 5104 - B5 Series 1 Collectors Box 4
Dr. Steven Franklin
Lou Welch
Ock
Psi-Cop Ms. Kelsey
Jason Ironheart


B 5105 - B5 Series 1 Collectors Box 5
Lord Kiro
Centauri Bodyguard
Mr. Bester
Lady Ladira
Raider in Trenchcoat


B 5106 - B5 Series 1 Collectors Box 6
Walker Smith
Muta-do
Caliban
Vir Cotto
G’eoree the Shorin


B 5201 - B5 Series 2 Collectors Box 1
Markab Ambassador
Purple Drazi
Green Drazi
Warren Keffler
Jack


B 5202 - B5 Series 2 Collectors Box 2
General W. Hague
Elric Techno-Mage
Amos
Delenn Transformed
Kalain


B 5203 - B5 Series 2 Collectors Box 3
Ranger Marcus Cole
Edward the Monk
Drazi Priest
Minbari Controller
Thug from Downbelow


B 5204 - B5 Series 2 Collectors Box 4
Brother Theo
Security Officer
Mr. Endowi
Lennier
Mr. Morden


B 5206 - B5 Series 2 Collectors Box 6
Timov
Daggair
Mariel
Cpt. J. Sheridan
Indian Psychic


B 5401 - B5 Series 4 Collectors Box 1
Ulkesh Naranek
DownBelow Scum
Alien Citizen
Emperor Cartagia
Centauri Royal Guard


B 5501 - B5 Series 5 Collectors Box 1
Cpt. E. Lochley
Security w. Big Gun
Assassin
Helmeted Gaim
Unhelmeted Gaim


B 5502 - B5 Series 5 Collectors Box 2
G’Kar Enlightened
Narn Warrior
Psi-Cop
Space Engineer
Llort Ambassador


B 5601 - B5 Series 6 Collectors Box 1
President Sheridan
Duncan
Byron
Garibaldi
Zak Allen


B 5602 - B5 Series 6 Collectors Box 2
Ltd. Corwin
Rouge Psyker
Na’Toth
Talia Winters
Hybrid Delenn


B 5603 - B5 Series 6 Collectors Box 3
G’Kar in Uniform
Parasite Victim
Tall Buyer
Minbari Delenn
Ambassador Kosh
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Postby E Nicely » Sat Apr 17, 2004 3:39 pm

I seem to be the only B5W player on these boards that no longer has his minis. Bummer. Now I really regret selling them.

It would stand to reason that if Mongoose is releasing a minis game they should release minis to go with the rules. New (non-B5W) players would be condemmed to using cardboard counters (and the old, shipless players of B5W as well). Even if Bruce Graw is selling the old minis online, they are a finite resource, as stated before, and will one day be unavailable. When they are gone they're gone. There will be players who want minis that won't be able to get them. New minis are a must-have IMO. Even if the new ship combat game were even a marginal success there would be a demand for ship models.

And something else, a new miniatures game (with a whole new set of game mechanics)that relied on the models of an older, out of print game wouldn't really seem to be a stand-alone game. There's still lots of us that love painting and collecting minis that never liked the collectible pre-painted crap that is so popular. There's quite a few minis guys here in San Diego that don't do counters and din't do collectibles. If B5W minis are the only option this would make a few potential players stay away from playing the new game, since there wouldn't be any miniatures available.
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Postby Greg Smith » Sat Apr 17, 2004 4:30 pm

ShadowScout wrote:
ronbogard wrote:Thats cool thanks Grey Smith but I cant make out what figures are in each box.
Maybe an list would help... let's see...
Thanks SS, I was just going to dig through my old copies of The One Ring magazine to do a list. You've saved me a job. :)
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